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Bob Branstetter
02-19-2007, 08:54 PM
As has been noted many times, basses have been sold under "House Brands" for the past 100 years or so. Most of these are not mentioned in the traditional reference books (Henley, Jalovec, etc) since there was no real person of that name making them. My favorite reference books for the "House Brands" is the 3 book set titled "Violin Identification and Price Guide published in originally in 1978 by Roy Ehrhardt of Heart of America Press (http://www.hoapress.com/viodesc.htm). The books were based on the huge collection of old instrument catalogs and brochures that had been saved by my late mentor, Earsel V. Atchey. The books contains reprints of hundreds old catalogs and brochures with what was considered the retail value in 1978. By careful cross referencing, Ehrhardt and Atchley were able to turn the old catalogs into a very useful book for violin dealers and collectors. The 3 volume set covers the great majority of all of the violins and violin family instruments that were made or imported into the United States from about 1880 until the date of book publication. While this is not a bass book, it does provide information about many basses. Even when the basses of a particular house brand are not included, the information about the violins (brands) is applicable to basses as well.

Unfortunately, the first volume of the set is no longer in print. However, it does frequently show up on the listings of violin book dealers. Hopefully, they will reprint this book in the future. The 2nd and 3rd volumes are available from the publisher for $55.00 each. The books are all 8-1/2" x 11" soft cover. IMO, the first volume is the best of the three, but all three are really required to cover every brand listed. The current values shown in the books were never updated in later editions, so they are not usable today. However, the original prices that were printed in the original catalogs are valuable for comparing relative value between brands. If you can find them, they are a great addition to any reference library.

Ken Smith
02-19-2007, 10:30 PM
Bob, thank's for coming up with this Thread idea. I don't know of those books but I do have a dozen or so other books to mention. What I would like to do then if you don't mind is list all the Books I have in my collection some of which have little to do directly with Basses but still, 'it's in the Family'!

Give me a day or so to pile them up and sort them as I have a collection of English makers books as well as the usual ones and a few new recent books.

If I learn one single thing from any given book, it's worth its price to me.

Hey, now that you've opened up this can of worms, how about I elect you 'The Ambassador of the House Brands' so we can all learn the names and makers as well of the periods of these Basses so more of us can understand these buried mysteries. Ok Bob?;)

PS: I see this Thread is in the 'Shop Bass' Forum but then again, that's where most of us started and where many have happily stayed. Therefore listing Books could be either here or in the Luthiers Forum. But, would that be any fun over there? Let me hear some opinions and I will wait to post my list and edit my post here after it's decided where to put these books.

Bob Branstetter
02-20-2007, 11:33 AM
I think a book list is a great idea Ken. However, I think you need to include a short description of what each book covers along with the name of the book. If you can keep the book list open, I'll add any that I have that are not already on your list. Maybe you can incorporate my list into yours so that the list would be intact. I would have no objection to moving my thread to wherever you decide to put the book listing. We might even include some links to some of the current violin book dealers since most people don't know that such places exist.

Do you know if anyone took over the book selling business (in D.C.) when Oscar Shapiro died? When I was younger, he was only person I knew who specialized in violin family books.

At one time there was talk of the VSA reissuing all of it's Journal back issues on DVD. That would be a treasure if it were available with cross referencing. I have a nearly complete set of the back issues that I purchased from my mentor, Earsel Atchley, shortly before he died and those old journals are a gold mine of information.

Ken Smith
02-20-2007, 06:27 PM
Ok now, Bob Branstetter opened up this subject in the Shop Bass Section but I have moved it here. We have discussed the problem on line and by PM where to put this Thread. I think right here in 'General Bass Talk' is the best place so as not to corner one school or period of making. I have bought several Books since I was in High School and my collection has grown quite large. After acquiring my first of 4 old English Basses I started hunting for Books that were English makers specifically. I learned a ton of knowledge that before reading some of these books, I had no idea just how big this school of makers was. I also dived deep in the the American Bass makers school first after buying my Batchelder and more so when I got my Prescott. Although there are some books that include all Schools of making, there are many that are focused on just one country. No book has it all and even with dozens of books published, some makers have gone totally unnoticed by all of them.

I will now attempt to list my collection of books by wither general or school. I will answer questions about them as I can but I am looking for others to add to the list as I don't have them all. *Some of the Books listed are 100 years old or more or originally written in the 19th century and recently been re-published.*
---------------------------------------
General Schools;
The Violin/Le Violon (Hart)*
Violin and its Music (Hart)*
History of the Violin (Sandys & Forster)*
A New History of the Double Bass (Brun)
The Red Book 2006 Guide Auctions Str. Inst./Bows (Cohen)
Universal Dictionary of Violin/Bow Makers (Henley)
Violin Makers (C.Stainer)*
The Baroque Double Bass (Planyavsky)
Introduction to the Double Bass (Elgar)
More About the Double Bass (Elgar)
Looking at the Double Bass (Elgar)
Amadeus Book of the Violin (Kolneder)
Four Centuries or Violin Makers (Sotheby's) (mainly Italian makers)
The Violin World (Pickering)
Encyclopedia of Violin Makers Book (Jalovec 2 vol)
---------------------------------------
Italian School;
Gio: Paolo Maggini (Hill)
Liuteri & Sonadori (Pio)
Dict. of 20th Cent. Italian Violin Makers (Brinsler)
Italian Violin Makers (Jalovec)
Antonio Stradivari, His Life & Work (Hills)
Italian Violin Makers (Hamma)
---------------------------------------
English/British;
Edward Withers/230 Years in Soho (Whone)
Violin Family and Makers in the British Isles (Harvey)
Dictionary of British Violin/Bow Makers (Plowright)
Benjamin Banks the Salisbury Vln Mkr (Cooper)
Arthur Bultitude and the Hill Tradition (Sadler)
British Violin Makers (Morris)*
The British Violin (BVMA)
---------------------------------------
German and Austrian School;
German & Austrian Violin Makers Book (Jalovec)
---------------------------------------
American School:
Violin Makers of the U.S. (Wenberg)
---------------------------------------
Chinese School;
Guidebook of Chinese Violin/Bow Makers (Bocca Chiusa co.)
---------------------------------------
NOTE: As more Books are mentioned and listed, I will start another Thread of known Violin/Bass Books and put a Sticky Thread at the top adding all the new listings.

David Powell
02-22-2007, 10:44 AM
Ken, I know print copies of the Hill Bros. book on Antonio Stradivari are somewhat rare. Years ago, your discussion about Stradivari led me to look for the book and I found a whole website version of the book with many photos and illustrations. :) The site is still apparently being maintained and here is the link. It is possible of course to view and save the pages as formatted along with the illustrations:

http://www.cello.org/heaven/hill/index.htm

Bob Reynolds
02-25-2007, 07:27 PM
Does anyone know where the term "F-Hole" came from
in respect to the Violin family of instruments.

Obviously, it is shaped similar to the letter F.
Someone told me it meant "Florentine" but I
cannot find any information in any books or online.

:confused:

David Powell
02-26-2007, 10:29 AM
Does anyone know where the term "F-Hole" came from
in respect to the Violin family of instruments.

Obviously, it is shaped similar to the letter F.
Someone told me it meant "Florentine" but I
cannot find any information in any books or online.

:confused:It is curious really because at the time f-holes largely replaced C-holes, that letter that now looks like an "f" was in middle English the "ss". If you can find a first folio of Shakespeare you will see it everywhere there is a word with "ss". So it is really an "ss" hole. :eek:
Hmm. Maybe that's why they call it an f-hole ....

Ron Lacey
03-27-2007, 04:23 PM
[snip]My favorite reference books for the "House Brands" is the 3 book set titled "Violin Identification and Price Guide published in originally in 1978 by Roy Ehrhardt of Heart of America Press (http://www.hoapress.com/viodesc.htm).

[snip]Unfortunately, the first volume of the set is no longer in print.

Looks like only the second volume is now available and the copyright and page proofs are for sale at $50K. Probably won't be back in print unless someone buys the rights.

Bob Branstetter
04-07-2007, 09:52 PM
Looks like only the second volume is now available and the copyright and page proofs are for sale at $50K. Probably won't be back in print unless someone buys the rights.That's unfortunate. With the low profit margin in this type of books, I will be VERY surprised if anyone will pop $50,000 for a book that that hasn't been updated in 30 years. With Earsel Atchley, the person who supplied all the information in the books, gone, I doubt if there is anyone around who would want to tackle the job of updating the price/value of the instruments in the books. They might be a good books to buy (on eBay, or music book sellers) and hold for the future. I understand that the second volumes that is being sold are photocopies of the original rather than being made from the original (offset?) plates.

[added] If anyone is considering buying only one of these books, make sure you get volume I first. The other 2 volumes are really supplimental to the first.