A Bass, but no Maker

[Paulien van Mourik]

Hi guys,

- I actually started this thread on TB, but was redirected here, 'cause of your expertise;) -
I play a borrowed bass from my orchestra. It's Russian, and I haven't got a clue where they got it from (the other two basses they own are Dutch). I was kinda hoping any of you have knowledge of Russian basses, because there doesn't seem to be much information on the internet.
The bass has got a tag inside, saying "Model Antonius Stradivarius Anno 1700, Made In USSR, Moskow 1969, N. 355". There is only a blue sigil with a kind of harp as a sign of a factory or a brand on the label (See photo). I've added some photos, and hope you can answer some questions about it, like:
- Is it handmade or is it from a factory?
- Why are it's shoulders uneven?
- What quality is it? (or can't you tell that from pictures :confused:)
- Why has it's back got that arch/slope, is it common?
If you recognize the sigil or the model, if you know an answer to one of my questions, or just know more about (this kind of) double basses, please share.
By the way, it might have a little difference in colour due to bad lightning and flashing. Oh and it looks a little dusty. Thats the flash too. I dust it regularly ofc. Also, it looks like it's been used as some kind of battering ram or something. I didn't do it!:eek:
If you need more photo's, I can upload more.
Thanks!

[Ken Smith]

I don't know 'this' bass but I do know the style. This is a modern Czech style bass with those outer rib linings flush to the top and back. The gears look nice and the shape looks very 'friendly' in the shoulders.

I have heard of makers in central Europe making basses for Russia as well as makers going there to work part of their life or coming from there to other parts of central Europe. This is what I call a Germanic/Czech style bass. The fact that the label is written in English means to me it was made for export to somewhere being that English was universal or something. Usually 'home grown' instruments are labeled in their native language. I would never label anything other than in my own language regardless of where it's going. Export product is often marked in English for some reason.

Looks like a nice bass to start out with and way above what the average person starting out gets regardless of age. When you have the chance, try taking some better pictures of the wood and details. It is hard to see much as far as grain or condition in these pictures you posted.

Best of luck with it..

[Adrian Levi]

I am curious about the uneven shoulders ?
I have a bass with one shoulder same as this one one more sloped ! I'm guessing that it was done to provide better access to the upper register as it certainly does DOES help , but then why just not slope both shoulders for a symmetrical look?
Any info would be interesting .....

[Ken Smith]

I am curious about the uneven shoulders ?
I have a bass with one shoulder same as this one one more sloped ! I'm guessing that it was done to provide better access to the upper register as it certainly does DOES help , but then why just not slope both shoulders for a symmetrical look?
Any info would be interesting .....

Many old basses especially hand made are uneven. Also, many larger basses when cut down end up uneven as well. maybe for a reason and moyeb by accident. I have owned many. Look thru my DB pages (http://www.kensmithbasses.com/doublebasses/) and find them..;)

[Adrian Levi]

Many old basses especially hand made are uneven. Also, many larger basses when cut down end up uneven as well. maybe for a reason and moyeb by accident. I have owned many. Look thru my DB pages (http://www.kensmithbasses.com/doublebasses/) and find them..;)

I had a look and it was hard to find a bass that looked really even :D

[Ken Smith]

I had a look and it was hard to find a bass that looked really even :D

Most of my basses are hand made. That's the main difference. Factory carved tops, backs and basses in general will be uniform to the eye. Hand made basses are uniform to what ever the maker is drinking..:eek:

Another thing I find quite often are uneven set ff-holes and/or f-notches. The same reasons as above apply here as well.

The fact that a bass is perfectly even or way off to the naked eye has no bearing on the sound or quality of the bass. It may have a slight bearing on the makers detail or finishing work but I have seen some of the least beautiful and/or uniform old basses that sound amazing.

Try overlooking these factors when evaluating a bass. These 'even Steven' details are more for the Judges at a makers competition than a playing Gig or audition.

If the unevenness somewhere makes the bass hard to play, then and only then does it become an issue. At that point, if you like the bass, try working around it. I have seen players get up on their toes to play over the fingerboard with some high shouldered basses. Sure, low, even sloped shoulders are more fun to play over and may cut down the stretch or work to play it but if it's the sound you are after, get some high heel sneakers!:p

[Adrian Levi]

Most of my basses are hand made. That's the main difference. Factory carved tops, backs and basses in general will be uniform to the eye. Hand made basses are uniform to what ever the maker is drinking..:eek:

Another thing I find quite often are uneven set ff-holes and/or f-notches. The same reasons as above apply here as well.

The fact that a bass is perfectly even or way off to the naked eye has no bearing on the sound or quality of the bass. It may have a slight bearing on the makers detail or finishing work but I have seen some of the least beautiful and/or uniform old basses that sound amazing.

Try overlooking these factors when evaluating a bass. These 'even Steven' details are more for the Judges at a makers competition than a playing Gig or audition.

If the unevenness somewhere makes the bass hard to play, then and only then does it become an issue. At that point, if you like the bass, try working around it. I have seen players get up on their toes to play over the fingerboard with some high shouldered basses. Sure, low, even sloped shoulders are more fun to play over and may cut down the stretch or work to play it but if it's the sound you are after, get some high heel sneakers!:p

That is interesting !!
I have a question though - what is the definition of a factory carved bass ? I was under the impression that factory basses were basically handmade ,but by a group of individuals and not just one luthier ??

[Ken Smith]

That is interesting !!
I have a question though - what is the definition of a factory carved bass ? I was under the impression that factory basses were basically handmade ,but by a group of individuals and not just one luthier ??

Factory made and hand assembled is one thing. Shop made/Cottage industry and then hand assembled is another.

They do have carving machines now for well over 100 years. Carved Tops sometimes have the bassbar looking part left in known as 'integral'. These need to be carved out and a REAL bar made and put in.

There are many ways to make a product and run a business. Necks/Scrolls are often supplied to many makers from one single supplier. This is happening even today on more than one level.

[Matthew Tucker]

Personally, i find a little assymetry is beautiful ... and to me a perfectly symmetrical bass outline is rather boring.

Perhaps this is why "factory" basses appear so plain.

[igor kondur]

This bass was made for export in Moscon on music factory called "LIRA"
close to my home(10 miles)
Igor