French Bows

[Abe Gumroyan]

Hi Guys,

Have any of you gents seen a listing or personally seen any bass bows made by Pecatte or Tourte? I know their violin bows cost about the same as a house lol but was curious if they ever made bass bows. The most high end bow i have seen personally were some Sartory and Vigneron bows and they were in the 15K-20K range.

[Ken Smith]

Hi Guys,

Have any of you gents seen a listing or personally seen any bass bows made by Pecatte or Tourte? I know their violin bows cost about the same as a house lol but was curious if they ever made bass bows. The most high end bow i have seen personally were some Sartory and Vigneron bows and they were in the 15K-20K range.

Well I think I have heard of Pecatte Bass Bows but not sure which Pecatte might have made Bows for the Bass if not all of them. On the Tourte theory, I have never heard of one but it is possible. He is considered to be the father of the modern bow. Read here to learn more about Bow history. http://www.wps.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/bows_makers.htm#PARIS

One time when asking the current world renown bow expert Raffin about my Bazin and the history of the family members according to one of the websites like the one posted, he informed me that they were wrong on one of the generations concerning Bazin.

Still, much of the information we read is spot on. Sometimes its more a matter of opinion that actual fact.

[Abe Gumroyan]

Ken,

My bow repairmen in LA informed that a tourte bass bow did in fact exist. One of few ever made. It sold for 75K at christie's a couple of year's back.

[Dave Kaczorowski]

One time when asking the current world renown bow expert Raffin about my Bazin and the history of the family members according to one of the websites like the one posted, he informed me that they were wrong on one of the generations concerning Bazin.

Wrong on which part?

[Ken Smith]

Wrong on which part?

I don't exactly remember but it was something about the dates from some bow website that I asked him about.

[Joel Larsson]

It sold for 75K at christie's a couple of year's back.

Makes me kind of happy to play German... difficult to find anything more expensive than a pre-1921 Pfetzschner. :o

[Abe Gumroyan]

Yea I don't blame you. I think the most priciest German bow I've seen go for was for 5-6k and that was a gold mounted/snakewood stick made by Dolling. 5-6k for a French stick is considered on the cheap side lol :D

[Ken Smith]

Yea I don't blame you. I think the most priciest German bow I've seen go for was for 5-6k and that was a gold mounted/snakewood stick made by Dolling. 5-6k for a French stick is considered on the cheap side lol :D

Well 5-6K for a French stick is about Par for the best new makers but not the classics. I have several modern Bows by various makers that are as good as most any boy unless you are talking about something special. I mean playable beyond imagination, not just old and famous.

[Abe Gumroyan]

Agreed ... However I have seen some Morizot and Bazin sticks go in the 5-7 range. I recently played a beautiful Morizot with an ivory frog at David Gage which I recall was selling for 6k. My favortie modern makers are Lucchi and Lipkins, absolute works of art for sure. My Lucchi is a joy to play but can't compare to my Fetique, that's my registered weapon. Ken, are you playing your Lipkins Sartory fulltime or switching off with other sticks ?

[Ken Smith]

Agreed ... However I have seen some Morizot and Bazin sticks go in the 5-7 range. I recently played a beautiful Morizot with an ivory frog at David Gage which I recall was selling for 6k. My favortie modern makers are Lucchi and Lipkins, absolute works of art for sure. My Lucchi is a joy to play but can't compare to my Fetique, that's my registered weapon. Ken, are you playing your Lipkins Sartory fulltime or switching off with other sticks ?

First off, I owned a Morizot with Ivory frog many years ago. It was not as good a Bow as it looked. I think Morizot Bows are the low end of the classic French Bows as compared to Sartory, Fetique, Peccatte etc.. I actually owned a few of the Morizot's back in my day but more or less just bought them as available for re-sale. I never really used one personally. My min Bow then was a fantastic Sartory so a Morizot of any kind was no match for my Eugene! I also owned two Lucchi Bows made in Bologna from before he moved to Cremona. Biase brought over 6 of them. He took 2 for himself, I cherry picked the next 2 and he sold the last 2 individually. I actually met Lucchi back in 1988 when he came over for a Guitar Symposium that was held out in Pa. near Martin Guitars. He also came over to my NYC apartment and showed me his wood meter. He took 2 pieces of Quilted Maple I had that was waiting for me to take them to the shop for use and measured them. He showed how on the meter that the less beautiful piece was actually the best piece tonally according to his 'Elasticity meter'.

For me, the Lipkins Sartory is my favorite and main bow but depending on the Bass I use, the strings on that Bass at the time and the program I am performing I sometimes choose the Bow that works best for the piece. That includes my Eibert bow, my Slaviero bow and my Bazin bow. My Bultitude #3 will hit rotation with the others as soon as it comes back from restoration at Sue's. This week, it's the Lipkins Sartory on the Hart bass with Belcanto's on it. Monday's rehearsal I used the Olde English 4/4 which has Evah Weichs on and the Slaviero actually sounded better there so the Lipkin's went back on the rack, not in the quiver. Because of the D'ish Neck Heel on the Monster, I switched to the Hart's Eb Heel because I just need to get 'up there' with less strain. The stretch from the Thumb resting in the Heel to the pinky touching the F# is well over an inch difference in distance between the two basses. I just need the bass with the least path of resistance for the program I have this week doing the Prokofiev's Romeo Suite. Intonation was a challenge for me Monday night with the upper notes mainly duet o the Heel and that's something I can't afford to have a problem with. The Hart Bass is just much easier for me up there mainly because of the Heel. The String Length is only 1/8" longer so that's not the issue. It's just plain reach.

So, the Bass I pick to use tells me itself, as it's strung, which Bow it likes. I just do the testing and the Bass does the talking. Like having another wife, can't get a word in edge-wise.. lol

[Joel Larsson]

Romeo and Juliet!! I have heard the last movement in very different tempi - one as short as 5:00, one as long as 6:30, if I remember correctly... I hope your conductor will play it that slow, it was quite something!