Your Favorite tone setting...
 

Hello all! Just joined the KSB club a few days ago with a stunning Black Tiger 5 string. My question as a newbie-do you have a favorite setting for your tone? I know every player is different, and every bass is unique etc.-but with such a large choice of tonal variations on this bass I wonder if some of you have particular settings you could share.

For example, this sounded pretty jazzy to me so far:

Balance slightly towards the rear PU
toggles both down
1/4 turn +bass
1/8 turn +treble
flat mid

something like that....

I would love to hear some of your insights, and what styles they work well for. Thanks!
Here's a pic from Ken before she was stringed...

Attachment 1570

Hi Jason and Welcome here.

Unless you are playing directly to the line mix board,( then maybe the bass controls are the only to take in consideration), I really think that the overall bass tone for a player is a sum of several things like: bass type, strings, cables, amplifiers, boxes, effects and of course playing technique.

In this case it's rather difficult to have a sound formula or a sound refference only with the position of the bass' controls.

Best regards

I agree, sort of. But when I first picked up my KSB I was shown various settings that produced entirely different sounds with fairly specific identities. Panned all the way to the back PU with the bass turned up and the midrange pumped a bit gave it a "Jaco" sound.

Both toggle switches up gave the bass more of a fender precision sound, especially with the treble turned down a bit.

I run my GK 700 straight up pretty much, but even through other amps the basic tone of the bass comes through.

Maybe it is kind of a plebeian question, but my last bass was a 1977 Music Man Stingray with a volume control and treble/Bass. Not much choice-although it sounds great. My friend Trevor showed me how he likes to set his KSB tone controls-it was pretty interesting. I also wondered if anyone fools around with one toggle up, the other down etc.

So I guess the better way to phrase this newbie question is:
Do you have an unusual setting you use to give your KSB a "Unique" tone?
If nobody answers I will move on... ;)

Tone settings?
 

Any response you would get would be subjective at best: Way to many variables. You really need to experiment and dial-in the tone that works for you. The Smith circuit is not a complicated one and with the right bass and amplification set-up, you should be able to achieve the tone that not only defines a Smith but settles into the mix as it should. :)

I run my amp flat, and control tone entirely from my Smith.

I run bass boosted (about 2 o'clock),
Mids flat to slightly cut,
Treble boosted slightly (about 1 o'clock)
pickup balance slightly favoring bridge, (about 11 o'clock)
and vary between both pickups in parallel, or neck pickup in series.

All in all, you and I arrived at about the same settings.

First actual band rehearsal with the KSB today-the guys loved the way it sounds! I love the extra boost you get by running both PU's in parallel-Classic older sound only more present.
We do a variety of modern jazz through older 40's & 50's material, the versatility is great.
Thanks for responding! :)

Tone
 

I run everything flat, with a touch of bass boost. My sound guy loves me to death.

Mike

Sorry for my question but...my luthier instaled a new 3 pot circuit and i'm not sure of the position of pots.

Is anybody can say to me what the exact position of these pots ? i mean the white line of pot...

Sorry for my very bad english :rolleyes: :D

My favorite tone position - flat:). sometimes when I use only the neck pickup and need more bottom - a slight bass boost.

Nobody to help me ?

Maybe a pic with 3 pots all the way down can help me...

I use generaly volume at max, balance changing with music i play, for rock in center position, for jazz, reggae, blues, more or less neck pickup and for funk or fusion, more or less bridge pickup.

I don't like too much hight ( i'm the bassman men :D) but sometime a little bost bass :)

model?
 

This is a Smith bass I assume? The BT concentric 2-band EQ bass & treble?

Yes ken, a BT6 1992 with BT concentric 3 W circuit.

ok..
 

To you and all the others I might add that tone settings on a bass will vary with the actual bass. If you have two Smith basses of the same model side by side but in different woods I can almost bet that you will set them differently even if only slightly.

When you play in various rooms, clubs, concert halls, different parts of the world or even different seasons in the same room, the sound traveling through the air will not be the same. You will probably adjust both your bass and your amp to get the sound closest to what's in your head or to please your ear.

How many of you agree on this?

Absolutely agreed Ken, specially when we are speaking about a “Limited Edition" - lol

Best regards

I agree, but I'll say that for any room I've never had to adjust any control more than maybe 1/8 turn.. At least on my Smith. it just sounds good in almost any environment =)

I agree to, especialy when the weather is wet...

I agree
 

In my opinion everything changes every time I play... Distance from the amp, distance from another musicians, drum, brass section blowing your head out...:eek:
So, I leave my controls unchanged to send a flat tone to FOH, where a good sound engineer can shape my sound the way he wants, and I adjust the EQ in my amp to fit that specific room where I'm playing.
This makes sense to me since I like my bass flat.

Same here...

If I don't get the sound I want with all EQ's flat (Including amp), I know that this is a result of a bad room, a mediocre amp or both... Then I will only play with the amp's EQ to get close to my sound, sending flat signal to FOH - most of the time I will not get exactly the sound I'm looking for from the amp..

Maybe for every situation and player there is the best bass/amp combination, but if I go through a good rig (ampeg SVT2Pro or SVT CL, paired with 8x10 or 2x15 are my favorites, also had good experience with Eden rigs and old fender BXR 400 heads with good cabs) all I need to do is to plug the bass, all EQ's flat, turn up the volume and this is my sound right there!

Hi everybody,

Runing the bass flat, to me it's like a hamburger without onions, mustard and ketchup.
On Smith basses we find one of the best bass 3 band eq ever and all the knobs are there to be tweaked in order to reach the best palette of sounds needed for the gigs or studio songs.
On amps like Ampeg or others, only the preamp section worth hundreds of $$ and I think it's a waiste of money to run these amps flat. (btw, if anybody knows how can we run an Ampeg SVT tube amp flat, please share, because I don't think it's possible - as only by the fact that you are playing a tube amp, the sound will be well coloured by the tubes)

So the eq board on Smith basses and amps is there to be utilised, and only our creativity must be the border line.
If not, a DI is largely enough...
It's just like some nice clothes; each time we wear something different we look a little different and generaly we wear for any occasion different closes (try to enter in your local Opera House dressed with your beloved rainbow coloured jogging sweat shirt...or better, nacked), but this will not change our personality.

Best regards

Well said! I could never understand flat settings only regardless of room and speaker and all other components. Such a waste of high end electronics. If all a player needed was flat then cheaper would be better cost wise.

My Favorite Tone Setting...
 

My favorite setting is ... well... a new set of Ken Smith Burner strings. The nickel type.:)

All the EQ settings cannot replace a fresh set of strings.

Secondly. A nice sounding cabinet seems to make the tone just pop out in the mix.

I know this is slightly off topic - but since the subject is "tone";
mentioning the basic ingredients wouldn't be too far off topic.

Bass (BMT or BSR) + New Strings (Burners) + Nice cabinet( a good one) = That sparkling Ken Smith Tone.

Flat settings
 

Well, my point is that I do change EQs, but when I'm not in the studio I usually do that in my amp, not in the bass, so I can shape the sound to the room where I am and send the tone that I like from my bass to FOH.
Flat setting is just another one among infinite possibilities Ken's EQ provides. And I think it works just fine.

Best Regards

1000+. With this combination I can't seem to get a bad sound out of my BT5G no matter how the EQ settings on the bass are adjusted. In addition I tend to also tweak my tone with hand position, attack, etc.; so, I usually leave the bass flat until the strings start to die.

Tone is in your touch & technique
 

EQ settings, running flat, or however you desire still cannot replace a players abilities with touch and technique.
Your pluck, thump, slap, pop, attack, release, and control of the strings are ... well...
more important than EQ settings.

This ultimately is the determining factor of "your" tone.

Check out this youtube example: from the 7 minute mark...
clearly, a demonstration of total control of the tone, with touch & technique.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R0e0Y...eature=related
( I believe this is Ken Smith BT6 - red stain color; rarely seen like this?)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z51o7...eature=related
(Jerry Brooks Solo with red Smith BT6)

Oh yes...
Tone is such a subjective topic... "ear" of the beholder.

No More Comments?
 

I hope I did not kill this thread...

I played my 7-string bass last night, with a LMKII head... it was nice. I might get another gig out of it.

Kill what?
 

I have noticed tons of youtube clips with Smith basses. Just put 'ken smith' in the youtube search, pull up a chair and listen all day to more clips that I can count.

For me, (if playing electric bass) I get the sound I need with the bass and amp at hand. The room and stage have a lot to do with it. I would say it's equally or even more important to have the sound in your head you are shooting for than to have pre-fixed settings planned.

I usually use both pickups balanced firts of all. Usually medium Tapercore strings and fairly fresh regardless of the venue. Form there it depends on the amp and how the amp sounds in the room. I like to set-up the amp for the room to get the basic sound I am looking for with the bass controls still set flat. I would prefer to make my tweaks or adjustments from the bass rather then reaching back to the amp. I usually have the volume out full on the bass but holding that back incase you need a quick on-board boost isn't a bad idea.

For tight funk sound setting with any amount of slapping to do (I haven't slapped much in years) I would raise equally the the bass and treble and cut the mids. This gives the bass a 'notched' setting. For jazz or pop or straight non-pop/slap R&B I do what ever works at the time. Playing with a small group verses a large group with horns will require different settings to cut through.

I would say the best setting is what pleases your ear and what people out in the house or hall tell you sounds best out there as well.

The exact bass you have in model or woods (woods matter a lot for tone settings) and settings between 4, 5, 6, and 7 string will vary even if each bass on the same gig in the same hands with the same strings is the exact same model and woods because, the mass in the neck woods matter. An open G sounds different on a 4, 5, 6 and 7 because of how much wood is under it.

So, use your head (mind really) and ears to know what you want to sound like and set you amp first. Then do the fine tuning with the Bass preamp.

Sometimes after you get it just right, someone in the band tells you, too much this or not enough that or.. the house engineer say.. put it all flat, I'll mix it in the booth... lol

Keep an open mind and make good music.

That was exactly my point... Every amp is engineered to have a certain sound (a preset EQ if you will). What I have found is that most of the amps that need messing around with the sound to get the sound you want, will almost always sound less natural (I know a lot of bass players ARE after this low& high boosted with no mids) than amps that sound good when just turning up the volume...

And as both a musician and engineer, one thing I have learned the hard way - using a piece of gear (EQ/compressor etc.) just because you have one available or because it worth hundreds/thousands of $$ is not such a musical decision.

As Christopher Rhodes said (I think this is what he ultimately meant) - the sound is the bass, the strings, and your fingers!! Then the FOH or mix engineer can tweak it further to fit better in the mix..

I used to record and perform with the bass EQ'ed with the onboard EQ as "my tone", I have found it harder to control in the mix, as did the FOH engineers that I worked with. Since I started playing with flat settings on onboard EQ, my sound is more manageable, live and in studio.

One more thing - as I said in my first post - I do use the onboard EQ - just not as MY TONE but in extreme cases, when I need it (extreme sub-bass playing or compensating for thin sounding pickups for instance).

I still try to imagine the bass sound of Jaco RIP, Chris Squire, Geddy Lee or Mick Karn with flat settings...and telling to the sound engineer: "Listen man please find the bass sound that suits my playing, I know you can do it, I trust you...":p
What is also true is that too many great bass players do the DI and because of this their sound is kind of generic so, at least for me it's not possible to recognize who is playing the bass as the sound signature is absent.

I think that this is the difference between "safe and creative" soundwise speaking.;)

Best regards

humm
 

Anton,

I really respect your opinion but I don't agree with you. :(
Musicians such as those you mentioned are legends and I don't think they became what they are only turning one or two knobs.

I agree with Ken when he says the tone should be in our mind first. Sound personality is a thing that takes years and a lot of work to acquire.
Most part of the time when someone is playing, (s)he needs to instinctively and quickly decide to use the point of the finger, play notes 'staccato', play with all forefinger over the string to get a round tone, play close to the bridge, to the neck, slap, tapping, thumb plucking, pick, with vibrato or not, with slide or not... Decisions like that and articulation have much more to do with sound personality than anything related to EQs. This is my opinion.

Certainly I will never ask a sound engineer to find the right sound for me (that's my homework :D), but it's just impossible to be in the stage and among the audience at the same time... and yet discuss with the sound engineer how my bass should sound. In live performances he WILL make this decision! And it's OK! :rolleyes:

I don't know if I was clear enough in my last two posts but I only use flat tone when playing live and just because it's the sound I like to hear from my bass.
In the studio I have more time and confidence to discuss with the producer which kind of bass I will use and then what setting fits best for the song.

Well, at least in one thing I think we both agree: Ken's EQ is the best over there and we can count on it to go where we need, flat or not... ;)

I know all of this is very subjective matter, sorry if I am hitting to much the same key...

Keep making great music. Peace.

Best Regards.

Jose tudo bem, amigo.

Hi Jose,

One of the things that I like in this forum is that each of us can show openly his or her opinion (and respect this) even if some of us (50%) see it opposite.
As you said it, the final goal who keeps us connected: Playing and making great music.

Best regards