Info on Calvin Baker/Asa White
 

Looking for info on these two makers. I know that they made instruments in New England, and that Baker was a student of White, but that's about it. Anybody know anything? Searching hasn't turned up anything of note.

I have seen a Baker in the Elgar book and also a White in person. Small 3/4 gamba bass. Nothing special. The Baker is of a similar outline. Both Germanic in style.

Why do you ask?

http://www.smithbassforums.com/showthread.php?t=2193

I asked for opinions on the possible origin of this bass about 16 months ago; the conclusion that a few people came to was "probably German." I've taken the instrument to several luthiers since then, and they've all said "probably French." However, the bass had to have many cracks repaired and a new bass bar put in after a little accident (thank god for insurance) and this label was discovered when the top was taken off...
http://imgur.com/BRLvAte
http://imgur.com/BRLvAte
http://imgur.com/BRLvAte

humm..
 

So maybe it is American, same period as thought German or French and the wood on the back of all 3 basses do look slightly American, broad flamed Sugar Maple. Like Prescott and others had access to back then. So it might be a Baker. The one in the Elgar book only shows the Top, not the back.

Baker worked for Asa White in the beginning and then went out on his own eventually. if it says Baker, then it is Baker, not White. If so, it brings to close the mystery or 3 basses but, I think that the one I saw at Arnold's was the same bass from Chicago, just removed from there at that time. That makes it 2-basses, not 3 of this pattern.

Another possibility is that it's a factory French or German instrument that Baker imported and put his own label on.

Michael Cahill showed up in the last thread with pics of his own bass, so his + mine + the Chicago one make 3 total. I would be curious to know if the other two have the same label... might be time to send out some emails. The one in mine was extremely faded, as you can see from the picture, which is why I never knew it was there until the top came off.

I doubt that. The wood looks like domestic maple, similar to other Yankee basses. Imports would not have carvings like that in the button. Never seen one.

I think the Chicago bass was Michael's. That makes two then, his and yours. I don't think a label was in there. Michelle and Arnold combined would have found it.

Nope, there are three
 

I stilll have mine and I think the third is still in Chicago. As far as I know, there's no label in mine. Carl's bass does not have outer linings but they look like cousins if not sisters, to me.

It's entirely possible that my bass used to have linings that were removed at one point. Not all of its ribs are original.

If the linings were removed then there would be a clear shadow all around the ribs. Also, the plates would be sticking over the ribs about twice as much unless it was made flush with no overhang. I do not see that in the pictures.

Michael, the bass from Chicago is no longer listed. I thought your bass was that same bass.

Group photo?
 

Possible Baker bass
 

Hi, Sorry I haven't had a chance to generally introduce myself, but I am a luthier ( one of the Brotherhood of loosely associated bass luthiers of America)
who recently acquired an interesting American bass, which is missing its original top. There is an inscription on the back "Calvin Baker 1885"
The outline of the bass is similar to a Baker, but it lacks the distinctive work at the button, and the machine heads are obviously German commercial of the period, and the pegbox was built to follow the plates of those machines.
Baker's shop looks to have been a busy place in this time period judging by the large # of violins that have auction results, so I assume they may have employed a number of craftsman.
Anyway, I am seeking more info on, and photos of known Baker basses.
I acquired this bass in part because I am "warming up" for my first bass build after years of restoration work on basses and having made a number of violins under Karl Roy, etc. and was looking to make a top as a way of gearing up.
I am particularly hoping someone can get me photos of, or a tracing of Baker's F hole pattern if this turns out to be a Baker.

detail possible Baker bass.
 

hope this includes the pictures?

more detail Baker (or whatever it is…)
 

Inscription.

detail possible Baker bass.
 

volute detail.

detail possible Baker bass.
 

Button. and upper back

Possible Baker bass
 

One more, side and back.

Mark, although it doesn't look exactly like the other C.Bakers I have seen (2-3 pictured and one of those in person and didn't know then it was Baker), it only looks slightly Germanic. The Arching of the back looks like his other basses and the upper back design is not typical German. The Asa White bass I played was similar as well to this but was a small bass, 1/2 sized I think but today called 5/8 for marketing. The handwritten name is a puzzle as I thought he branded and or labeled his work. So, I don't know if this is his bass but could be possible. Also, if the label was destroyed in a repair someone could have also written it to mark what the bass was.

It is also possible that the Scroll/Neck is German and used by him to save time or has been replaced since it was made. In that case, you have just the Back and Ribs that he may have made if the Top as you say is replaced as well.

To me the C-bouts look kind of Yankee, not German. The head however is not by the maker of the corpus, in my opinion. It looks factory German.

Bingo. Zachary Martin, who consigned the bass for the previous owner, told me the bass was originally blockless and a German neck was added at some point, I assume when the block was added. God knows what became of the original neck and machines.

The original top was THROWN OUT when it started to sag 40 years ago and a crude, thick replacement was carved and slapped on. Bunchasavages.

Maybe there are 4?
 

Here's another without the outer linings but with the button.

http://www.befr.ebay.be/itm/1870s-Ca...wAAOSwAYtWJZzP

That one is pretty much identical to mine, down to the label, although that one is in better shape and appears to be 100% original. Assuming it sounds as good as mine, whoever paid 5k for that got one hell of a deal.

I have much, much better pictures of that bass pre-"restoration." The photos in the eBay ad are deceiving. The seller is not a musician; his late mother bought the bass from her teacher 50+ years ago.

Serious belly sinkage, paper-thin edges on the top plate, ribs spiderwebbed with old cracks, 1/8" back seam separation from drying out in a closet for decades (gotta love air conditioning) and a partridge in a pear tree. Oh, and one of the four machines is not original if you look closely. The best thing I can say about it was that the neck was straight, and the maple was beautiful. If you look closely at the label photo, whoever worked on it didn't bother to replace the center seam cleats when they jammed the back plates together and slapped them onto the ribs. It's barbaric.

I was in the bank lobby ready to do the wire transfer to the owner's account while I was texting with my buddy in Florida, who was going to pick the bass up and hold it for me. I knew it was rough, but when the photos started coming in showing the extent of its' problems, I called the seller to bawl him out.

The seller cracked and admitted that he got a $5k repair estimate several years prior, but kindasorta forgot to mention that to me. He was desperate for cash, because he needed to pay a fine to settle a legal beef and leave the state. I told him to screw, kept my money and ended up with a beautiful Solano. There's more shadiness to the story, but that's the meat of it.

humm
 

If that bass walked in my shop, I might make an offer. Or, maybe not! :cool:

If he would have been upfront with me about the estimate, I would have paid his $3k asking price and rolled the dice. Rewarding dishonest behavior with piles of cash seemed like a bad idea.

It's all about the bass, not so much pride or honor. If you like the bass for a price, get it and have it restored. Afterwards, it's all old news and no one will care! :cool:

That's what Merchant told me after the fact, but like the saying goes, not with my money!

As I said above, I ended up buying a sweet Solano for less money from a very nice person who has since become a friend. I'm satisfied with the outcome.

Romano is a nice guy. I have spoken with him on the phone and have played in sections with 2 of his basses as well. ;)

Same experience here. I called him with the measurements, and he remembered precisely the batch of instruments that included this one. It's robust, sounds great under the bow, and was ready to play, which is just what I wanted. Not having to deal with cartage, restoration costs and shady people was the icing on the cake.

Ok, so it worked out for you. BUT, an older restored bass is something you wont know with the Solano as no one lives long enough to see a new bass get old.

True. It's not quite 20 years old and still moves around a fair amount as the seasons change, but it sounds quite good for what it is. I'm retired from performance for the foreseeable future, so I have no need for a world class instrument.