Sonore strings
 

Apparently, these are super-high end, ultra expensive German strings made in small quantities. Has anybody every encountered them, 'in real life'? All I have found online is an email address to the maker, geroldgenssler@gmx.de.

hi joel,
there is a thread in the other forum (sorry ken) about mr gensslers products
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=382000

and if you can read german many info in a german forum
http://www.geba-online.de/forum.php4

i never played these strings, but the guys who did are 100% convinced of their quality

Thanks Anselm, I don't know why I didn't see that thread. Perhaps it's because my focused has moved here. :rolleyes:

They do seem like a costly but nice alternative to all else. I just made a last minute application to that Bass Kaleidoscope course in Germany at the end of March; if there is still room for more participants, I might run into those strings, as he is said to show up there and showcase his stuff.

hi joel
thats interesting, maybe i will be there too.

That would be just great, Anselm. If there is room for me (I still haven't received any form of response), watch out for a guy with a red beard, too little hair for his age and a bad Swedish accent to my English.

ok, and you can watch out for somebody who looks like my avatar, but without a tailcoat.:)

(ever thought about using a pic of you as an avatar?)

A pic as an avatar, hm. Perhaps if I find myself having too much time on my hands someday. Which is likely to happen. Perhaps now; I am about to go to bed, it's just that I don't like going to bed so I keep looking for stuff to do!!

Try sleeping as something to do, then your problem will be solved.

Thanks Richard. Your wisdom is truly like a well where I have yet to reach the bottom.

i just talked to mr. genssler on the phone, he said he will be there with one bass and different strings to check out

And I just got confirmed that I can go. I don't think I'll be able to bring my own bass, though... seems like one has to go by train and bus. People always get mad at me when I bring too much luggage. Especially mothers of small children. They really hate me. They just can't understand that my bass is worth more than their kids. And I've done some counting on this! A child has to be over 3 years of age until so much money has been spent on it that it will technically speaking carry a greater value than my bass. Including the flight case, the kid'll have to be 3½. And at that age, they won't need a kid's carriage. This is why I have every right to claim the biggest space in the train as my own. :p
Anyways, Anselm, my friend, which route should I take? Flight to Berlin and then train towards wherever it is I should go?

well, joel, my friend, michaelstein is in the middle of nowhere, but i think if you fly to berlin, there must be a train next to it, and the remaing way by bus.
don´t they give you some roadmap at the office?

The Anfahrt part of the website is not very helpful. Their English translation is a bit contradictory. The problem is, that when I use Babelfish to translate the German version, it becomes just as contradictory! But I'll manage, I hope. I just thought that maybe you knew some secret trick.
I need to buy a bow down there. Some people will probably show up and try to sell us things, I mean apart from Herr Genssler, right?

i think so.




ok, you need a bow...i have some...

Bring 'em. :)

I need one from around €2,5k and up. The downside of buying stuff directly from people is that they tend to keep the best to themselves... what's your keeper? ;)

i have an about 60 years old german bow for sale. made in mittenwald and stamped "Albert Nürnberger"
but i doubt its the right bow for you, because i won´t sell it for 2,5k

But Nürnberger made good bows, didn't he? If it's cheaper but just as good as a billion dollar bow, I'd buy it anyway, you know. ;)

it´s 1500,-€

yes, he did. but my bow is a bow stamped "Albert Nürnberger", that means: anybody else exept Albert Nürnberger made it :(

Ah, one of those... like a Stradivarius bass.:eek:

I ran into an "H.R. Pfretzschner" on the Net before Christmas. It looked strange. Being the powerful and important man I am, I sent three bass players to check it out, one of which already owns three Pfretzschners. This one was strange, as it clearly wasn't what we usually associate with a Pfretzschner; it had a very low tip and was somewhere inbetween German and French, and had a rather clumsy brass peg. I HAVE heard that Pretzschner's early bass bows weren't what they later became - which isn't very surprising considering that he was something of a pioneer of the modern German bow - and it was indeed most similar to the earliest of the three bows they brought. They said it seemed to make a decent sound, but it needed work, and I wasn't very interested in spending my money on what wasn't necessarily a real H.R.P., so I let that one go. I'd still like to know whether it was real or not, though...

Hey, Joel! You can listen to the Sonore Corax here.

Gerlod was one of the founders of the Velvet string company. I think he took off to start his own business when they stopped making guts.

but, despite of being no nürnberger, its a good ca. 60 years old mittenwälder bow.
it was my main bow till i switched to my next main bow

hey joel and andreas
so much time for posting on a saturday at 20:00, don´t you have a gig?


ooops, ok, what about me...:o

My motto is that time and money are no problems.

I guess I could apply for scholarships or something. But, nah.

Andreas; thanks. They sound like something you could use, considering your strange string preferences. ;)
I am mostly interested in his Orchestrals and Red Labels. I hope he'll bring some of the latter to the course in March. Gut core is nice for orchestral playing but I have yet to play one that carries the power of a rope/steel/whatever all the way up above the FB.

have you tried oliv?

Yes, I had Oliv G and D and Eudoxa A and E for a while. Lovely orchestral strings, but I had to get other G and D's. The Olivs got all hoarse even before thumb position, and also had a tendency to stretch out when I played Koussevitzky, for instance. That is, they droppped in pitch, as much as a half note. But it was no idea to tune them on the run; if I'd let them be for a couple of minute they'd get back in tune. If I had made an attempt at tuning them up as the pitch went down, I'd end up one half note too high. VERY uncomfortable.
They could probably work for a classical concerto, for instance, but I soon got myself a couple of steel strings instead. I might get back to them the day I don't have to study any more.

Joel,
have you ever considered a full set of Eudoxas? But they really cost a fortune... And maybe they would behave similar to the Oliv?

??
 

I'm sorry but are these for Bowing or Pizz? Your usage I mean..

Both the Oliv's and Eudoxa's are Gut Core wrapped with flat metal. Silver or chrome steel doesn't matter. The fact remains that Gut stretched and metal does not. Also, the metal is wrapped around the string at an angle so when pulled over a bridge or nut, the windings can be pulled apart. This happens with all strings that I have seen but with Gut in the core, it is just a matter of time, sooner rather than later.

I have used a full set of Olivs as well as Oliv G/D withe Eudoxa A/E. They were shorter lived than any other string I can recall. The sound was fantastic and a dream to bow. The full set of Olivs on the bottom were not so easy to get a sound out of. I had them on my Martini which is a fairly dark sounding bass so not the best match there.

The Olivs are thicker in the Core than the Eudoxas and get to sounding a little choked in the upper positions. I do not recall ever playing the Eudoxa G or D. Maybe I should, you think? With an Extension E/C? Maybe my big old mystery bass will feel at home with them..;)

For me, in place of Guts or Gut wound string, I prefer the Evah's for durability and gut-like qualities, the good qualities of the Guts.:) They feel great under the fingers and pump out a nice sound with the Bow. The Belcantos are another good choice with slightly metallic sounding and less colorful. They do however bow fantastic and are quite loud and direct sounding.

I'm talking arco here. ;)

That's what I meant; the thinner core of the Eudoxa might have an advance in higher positions.

Yes, well, if somebody threw me an Eudoxa G I would be happy to try it. But I wouldn't buy them under the impression that they'd make great strings for solo arco playing. Someday I hope I'll be in a position where it's reasonable to focus on my orchestral sound, and where money is no issue any more, but for now, I'll stick to the cheaper stuff that actually sounds better for classical solo playing. I have a Bel Canto set that got stuck in the Norwegian customs... thought they'd be good for both solo and orchestra. But apparently I need a Norwegian ID number or something. This sucks.

Got to say, by the way, that the Eudoxas really do stay in tune, in case somebody ever doubted it. I get impressed from time to time, when my Orig Flats have dropped half a note but my A and E stay in tune just fine.

I have an old set of Eudoxa's on my second instrument. They're wonderful strings that bow extremely well. The sound starts to get choked once you reach the 2nd octave D on the G string...So no, you most certainly cannot solo on these strings...They're purely orchestral or jazz strings, and they're marvelous.

When I bought the F. Günter Hoyer bow from his son Matthias (and grandson, too, who had just taken up his ancestor's profession - love family businesses!) he (Matthias) told me that his father (the actual F. Günter) made bows for Nürnberger back in the day. The guy was born in 1926, so it might very well be a bow from before he inherited his father's workshop, or got the master's degree, or something. But perhaps you already knew this. Anyways, this F. Günter is still going strong, well past 80 as he is... and I love the bow I got, and, if the same guy did yours, I can see why you waited until now to get another. :cool:

Anyways, on the subject of Sonore, now that I've met Herr Genssler and seen him in action, I can see why you won't have to look any further after you've brought your bass to his shop and gotten a set. His Gut cores actually sound great in ALL position - fancy that!! - and the two year warranty makes it worth the money, considering the fact that a normal set of Eudoxas seem to last for, like, three months. He even almost succeeded in satisfying Thomas Martin, which according to Mr. Martin himself, is a very difficult thing to do. Too bad I don't live in Berlin...

So, did you purchase them?

So, do you have to bring him your bass to get strings from him? Or, can you just order them?

Not that I am going to. Good lord they are expensive. But, that two year warranty seems pretty sweet. Considering that I burn through 2 sets a year, typically, that might not be such a bad deal.

Andreas, dude, I'm BROKE!! I ain't getting a set of Sonores anytime in the foreseeable future... but someday... :rolleyes:
Plus, I didn't bring my own bass to the course. And Nathan, well, he wants to custom make the strings for you. Maybe you can talk him into producing a set based on your bass' measurements, but while I have no doubt that his strings will nevertheless be the best you have ever played, I think you'll miss out the best part if you don't take your bass to him - which is, trying all his promo sets until finally settling for the best of the best, knowing that your own set will be even better. :D

Sonores TWINE
 

Just thought I'd let folks know that I have had a set of Mr. Genssler's TWINE model strings on my bass for about 3 weeks now. They are all wound gut core strings. Not sure what the windings are - in fact they appear to be different for different strings.

First of all I'll say that dealing with Mr. Genssler has been fantastic. When I expressed interest in his strings, he searched out recordings of my playing and made recommendations to me based on what he heard and what he knew about my work. After going back and forth a few times, the TWINEs were the model he thought would be best for me, so I took the leap...

The strings are really really great. The arco sound is rich, warm and clear through the whole range of the bass. This is the first time I've used gut core strings, and I was surprised that they are quite thin (pretty similar dimension to spirocore weichs, for instance). They feel really nice under my fingers.

Pizz they are growly and have lots of sustain.

My only complaint is that arco the open strings don't want to start very cleanly. This has been improving as the strings settle in and as I get a better feel for how they respond to the bow.

How's that second mortgage workin' for ya? :)

Oh, I just told him to send the bill to you. Hope that was ok?

So, what kind of strings does this man make? Are they for orchestra? I don't know of anyone in the U.S using these strings asides from a few soloists. I'm sure they're popular in Germany.

He makes about any kind of string you can imagine as they are all hand made to order. Here are two slightly different lists of his "standard models" that were posted over on the "other" forum:

1. sonores DRAGO SOLO modernes Solospiel (auch in Normalstimmung spielbar)
2. sonores DRAGO BASSO modernes Orchesterspiel
3. sonores TWINE alte Musik/(mod. Orchester)-
4. sonores HELIX Jazz pizz/arco, alte Musik
5. sonores CORAX Jazz pizz/arco, alte Musik


CORAX -thick black gut for Jazz (bowing easily)
HELIX -helix wound medium gut for Jazz (bowing easily)
TWINE -thin gut core, roundwound with metal for jazz and bowing
DRAGO solo -thin gut core, roundwound with metal for modern bowing
DRAGO basso -thin gut core, roundwound with metal for modern bowing
RED LABEL solo -man-made core roundwound with metal for modern bowing
RED LABEL basso -man-made core roundwound with metal for modern bowing

The only two players I know of using his strings off the top of my head are Christian Weber in Switzerland and François Rabbath in France, although clearly there are others.