Jerome Thibouville Lamy Bass?

[Arnold Schnitzer]

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

Being machine carved in a factory you can expect the bass to be very heavily wooded inside which will affect the tone. Fully re-graduated plates will improve the sound but restoring and improving a bass like this will cost in the thousands even if you don't have a single crack to fix.

Ken, I think you paint Lamy basses a bit one-dimensionally. I have seen Lamy's that would compete with anything in terms of workmanship and sound. There is a magnificent one in National Symphony (you can see its lion-head scroll on my website). The plates on that bass are not thick, the detail work is excellent, and overall I'd give the bass a spirited thumbs-up.

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Arnold Schnitzer

Ken, I think you paint Lamy basses a bit one-dimensionally. I have seen Lamy's that would compete with anything in terms of workmanship and sound. There is a magnificent one in National Symphony (you can see its lion-head scroll on my website). The plates on that bass are not thick, the detail work is excellent, and overall I'd give the bass a spirited thumbs-up.

Ok, but we haven't seen this bass in person, any of us. The data on J.T.L. points to a factory. The Lion heads are done by Guild Carvers as that was a rule there then, no?.. Also, the bass you had there may have been re-graduated to its current state. Possible? Your buddy Jeff told me about a heavily wooded Lamy that was 'improved' in another shop many years ago. When done, it was so good that the shop owner being confused put in a more famous label thinking that the Lamy label was incorrect despite the insistence that the bass was a Lamy. That bass is now in use as something else due to the results.

I agree that these can be very nice basses and that the French Factory basses were better than the German factory instruments of the same period. The point is that although looking like a Vuillaume in shape and model, they are just not.

By the way, I know you have had at least one Vuillaume there in the shop (I saw it there) so how would you compare the two basses in sound?

The price to buy in dollars with bank rates and currency commission would be about $14k before shipping. Add that, a good set up, Fingerboard and Bridge maybe. Also a possible Neck Re-set and if this bass is wood from Europe, include some repairs if the back center opens or the Top splits from winter shrinkage in a year of two before it's sold. So.. what is the inventoried cost at that point? How fast do these French Cello models sell at market price?

My point is that locally, it may be a good or fair in the least 'individual' purchase. Across the Pond wholesale, the deal isn't quite as sweet looking.

If the Bass was here in the states for 50 years already then it would be something to persue but to bring it here and have it experience our climate for the first time could be very costly. The Mougenot I have came over here around 20 years ago as confirmed with the previous owner. The repairs from changing the geographic home of the Bass will not come cheap. The difference is that repairs cost the same per hour regardless of the pedigree of the Bass. Fixing a hand made Vuillaume or a Mougenot (Vuillaume school bass) is a smaller percentage of the worth of the bass when comparing it to a turn of the century factory French Bass.

[Arnold Schnitzer]

Portugal has a temperate climate and is not nearly as damp as the British Isles. I would not be overly concerned about importing a bass from there, especially if one is reasonably careful about maintaining decent humidity through the winter.

As far as the J.T. Lamy company using machines to rough-carve their bass plates--what difference does that make? If two instruments look and sound identical, and were made in the same shop, but one was rough-carved on machinery, does that significantly detract from its value? And how would one know?

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Arnold Schnitzer

Portugal has a temperate climate and is not nearly as damp as the British Isles. I would not be overly concerned about importing a bass from there, especially if one is reasonably careful about maintaining decent humidity through the winter.

As far as the J.T. Lamy company using machines to rough-carve their bass plates--what difference does that make? If two instruments look and sound identical, and were made in the same shop, but one was rough-carved on machinery, does that significantly detract from its value? And how would one know?

Correct BUT if the Plates are overly thick, re-graduating might be needed to optimize the sound. Just speculating here as none of us has seen this Bass.

So, is this Bass coming my way?

[Ken Smith]

I just got in one of these basses but it was restored about 2 years ago and modified as well at that time from 3 to 4 string so it was probably in storage un-played for quite some time.

Most of the things mentioned above were performed to improve the bass and results are impressive.

- The top was re-graduated.

- The flatback was also partially re-graduated where it was overly thick around the edges.

- The original single 'stair-step' center brace was replaced by a a single long diagonal brace.

- The long beechwood neck was replaced with a shorter maple neck graft shortening the string length down to 42".

- The neck-stand and block set were also improved for optimum playability.

After looking over the measurements of several J.-T. Lamy basses for sale or recently sold on-line I noticed that the violin cornered models were mostly under 42" string lengths and the gambas models with bigger overall body dimensions averaged at 42" or slightly bigger.

The bass I just acquired although quite large in the *7/8ths class (*USA measured), it plays quite easily with its current set up. The sound is nice and loose, huge, sweet and not at all typical French sounding due to its recent restoration work.

As I mentioned about, these French basses can be very nice if modifications are performed. The tone is very pleasing with the Bow and suitable for Orchestra or Jazz playing as well.

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Arnold Schnitzer

Ken, I think you paint Lamy basses a bit one-dimensionally. I have seen Lamy's that would compete with anything in terms of workmanship and sound. There is a magnificent one in National Symphony (you can see its lion-head scroll on my website). The plates on that bass are not thick, the detail work is excellent, and overall I'd give the bass a spirited thumbs-up.

Now that I have one in my hands and fully restored with the necessary modifications, I can see that these basses can sound as good as any other French makers bass, possibly better. It's like re-making a bass using 120 year old seasoned wood. Mine is a bit more on the plain side with medium figured maple back, lightly figured ribs and scratched purfling lines around both the top and back plates but has beautiful original French red varnish. According to an old 1891 Lamy catalog page I found, this was the middle grade flatback model. The next model up had the Purfling inlaid, same wood. This was made originally as a 3-string and remained that way until 2 years ago when it was finally modified to 4 strings. The bottom end is quite powerful.

Although not labeled or stamped, the Scroll, FFs and overall model is identical to other confirmed/marked Lamy basses. Others as well as myself estimate this bass to be from about 1890 comparing it to other similar examples.

[Ken Smith]

Here is the Link to the Lamy we got in recently. Enjoy the view!