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  #61  
Old 12-27-2008, 10:10 PM
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Originally Posted by John McGuire View Post
1). The ability to have a third pickup in the neck area. I'm sure this has been tried? Would this add some deeper tone to the perspective?

2). optional chambered cores in the body wing areas to reduce weight. I played a Sadowsky NY with a chambered body and it was an awesome improvement. I didn't notice any dif.

3). Electronics to be able to switch to an old school single coil kind of vibe.

Please don't shot me! These are just some ideas for discussion! I love the ken smith I just got. Great bass. However, I still am bringing two basses to the gigs I've been playing when I need an old school vibe I bring either a 65 jazz bass or an old 4003 Ric and in addition to the KS BSR5GN for the newer fusion jazz stuff we do.

1, 2, & 3.. Been there and done that.

The 3rd pickup is not worth the trouble tonally and will gove the Bass some added weight as well. Want more Bass, use the tone controls, active and passive..

The Body story you tell on that 'parts' brand. Did you Play that exact same bass with and without the chambers? Same body both times? If not, the results you claim were not science. Just one bass compared to another.

You have to route those chambers 'before' gluing things up. What happens if a small drip of glue breaks off into that now closed chamber or some wood dust or a wood chip? Also, how do you control the extra frequency bounce caused by the chambers? Want a real Bass? Buy that big thing they call a Double Bass. Want solid sounds and controlled? Then keep it as solid as possible.

On the Single Coil we have tested this years ago with this Pickup. We have some new 3-way switches to test out we just got in when time allows. My Distributor in Japan has put some of these in a few Basses.

So, how many ways can you slice an apple? Still an apple..
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  #62  
Old 12-28-2008, 06:57 PM
Bram Schoonderbeek Bram Schoonderbeek is offline
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Default Passive and tone control.

I'm prolly only one of few doing this.. but I play my Smith passive, as I do all my basses. One of my basses when switched to passive has the bass-knob acting like a tone rolloff knob a la jazz bass in passive mode... I love that! I know the passive switch is prolly and emergency escape when battery is dead you can swich to passive when playing on a gig, but I like passive cicuits more then active ones just cos somehow to my ears it has a little more dynamics to it, can hear my fingers better also difference between playng softly and hard is more apparant, plus somehow it makes the tone troathier and more raw... atleast it does on all my active basses, the rest of my basses is obviously allready passive
Passive works best on my Glockenklang rig, cos its so ridiclulously transparant... and I play that thing flat aswell....


Best regards

Bram
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  #63  
Old 01-29-2009, 10:25 AM
David Alan McIntire II David Alan McIntire II is offline
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A bit new here, so am afraid myself of Ken's comments, but here goes. One, I do feel a perceptable difference in my String through body basses, I have two such instruments, wit option to string through body OR bridge. Tried both ways, there is a difference in feel of string tension, and body resonance. As I can tune my bass unamplified on my chest without "hearin" anythin, when strung through, on stage wit all surrounding noise, can't do the same when they are strung through the bridge. The caveat being that my Smith does the same thing without extra holes drilled. Smith bridges are a marvel of design, apparently, and I love the resonance of mine. The 60's bass comparison is unfair, IMHO, they used flatwound strings back then, not a ton of sustain anyhow. And, just to say also that if the strings behind the bridge saddles don't vibrate, then does it matter if they are bent? I've had no issues with breakage or dead strings. And finally, use my Smith passive lots of the time, it's like having two basses in one. Passive sounds great for getting old school and rock tones, hit the switch and you have another beast, entirely. Better than ANY boost pedal made! Please, no one kill me. I'm new, tryin ta fit in.
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  #64  
Old 01-29-2009, 06:28 PM
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No one's going to kill you bro. Now, my Burner is very upper-midsy-honky when passive. I need a new pre circuit and can't afford it yet, so I'm just doing passive. I am not getting on with it yet, still trying.

One thing that may help is I'm getting rid of a Markbass Traveler 210 cab, which I pretty much don't dig at all. Too agressive, very 'toppy', and is probably contributing to my unhappiness thus far. Dunno though.

I'm used to Rickies, my Peavey Dyna-Bass Unity, stuff like that. It may be that the Smith is more refined than I can get on with. I'm not really a knucklehead, but maybe my bass playing is!
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  #65  
Old 01-29-2009, 08:12 PM
David Alan McIntire II David Alan McIntire II is offline
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I'm havin fun wit everyone's seeming fear of the big Man on campus here. I had a Burner 6 for a long time, before getting my current CR6. I do remember some of the issue you speak of. But it may just be that cab. I'm a real gear head, have owned and tried all kinds of amps, basses and such. I'm an old school tone guy as well, and this new, modern soundin gear is just not suited to get that tone. Especially cabs. 'Fore ya give up on that Burner, try some different cabs, for sure, but try ones wit different designs especially. Rear ports, sealed designs ALL have big differences in how clear and how NOT so clear ya want your tone. My current rig is pretty simple. Mesa M-Pulse 600 into a Bergantino HT-310. NOT Hi-Fi at all. The Mesa has HUGE low end, I temper that using tens in all my cabs. This is a front ported cab, and loud, but really responsive to my EQ settings. I've used Mark Bass gear, and all have commented about that "honk" thing. Try a different cab. I bet it makes a big difference.
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  #66  
Old 01-29-2009, 08:38 PM
David Alan McIntire II David Alan McIntire II is offline
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Hate to answer myself, but forgot to mention. Left the Burner series for two reasons. One, string spacing too tight for my taste, and two, no mid control. The one I had was Walnut, and its tone was such I swear by that wood now. Have you experimented with your pickup height? Can add or subtract detail of pickups. By lowering the pickups, you may lose a hair of output, but those old school basses had nowhere near the output of these modern monsters, and lowerin them may get some of the Middiness out of your sound, without the mid control. You could then make up a bit of output loss with gain on your amp. I understand Ken is marketing his pickups and electronics again, that would be the perfect choice. His pre amps the best, in my opinion, and that could also be your answer. Lots of options, really wish you the best on findin your tone.
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  #67  
Old 01-29-2009, 10:50 PM
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The Markbass is outta here as of Saturday. I have frankly never had a sound I've disliked as much as what I'm getting out of that cab! With every bass I have (there are 3 here) it does 'that thing', and maybe it is the problem with the Burner. Not sure though... I have played the bass through an Ashdown Evo head and Ampeg 410 Classic cab, and the troubling middley character was not nearly as pronounced. But still present... I want it to sound more like a Fender or a Rickie! Right now I'm having trouble getting it to give me that controlled and consistent growly rumble I like. Feels great, I dig the look. But sound is not working yet.

I have considered getting a couple Fender Jazz stock p'ups- the bridge position ones- and wiring the bass for them, replacing the (not-working) Smith preamp. Truth is I've just gotten back to carpentry (RI has the worst unemployment in the country right now, I believe), and don't have the scratch to bring this bass up to factory spec.

Just musing...
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  #68  
Old 01-30-2009, 01:23 AM
David Alan McIntire II David Alan McIntire II is offline
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Well what do ya know? I'm a carpenter myself, during the day. Jobs here in SC no more plentiful. I'm also originally from RI, but left there when 3 or so as my dad was in Navy. Just lost a job had for 5 years, and playin the only thing payin bills. I been around a while, this the worst I've ever seen the economy. Usually avoid that kind of issue, been playin all my life, but it's killin me now. I have a set of Bartolini passive J style pickups, and a three band Bart preamp in need of pots. Have the hard one to get, the push pull pot, but need a balance pot and two 50k tone controls. If you like, I can send them to ya. No worries. It's just sittin, and at moment I have no use for them. Over the years folks have helped me a ton. You can have this stuff if it helps, cuz one, hate to see ya disappointed in that Smith and two, all the help I've recieved I believe in givin back. Is your bass a 4 or 5 string? Or 6? Lemme know what ya think, but I believe the best thing for it would be the Smith stuff. I'm sure he'd work out a deal. But the offer here for the stuff I got. Maybe one day you'll return favor. Parts for this pre amp pretty cheap, I just don't have the gumption ta put it together, and nuttin to put it in.
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  #69  
Old 01-30-2009, 06:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Alan McIntire II View Post
Well what do ya know? I'm a carpenter myself, during the day. Jobs here in SC no more plentiful. I'm also originally from RI, but left there when 3 or so as my dad was in Navy. Just lost a job had for 5 years, and playin the only thing payin bills. I been around a while, this the worst I've ever seen the economy. Usually avoid that kind of issue, been playin all my life, but it's killin me now. I have a set of Bartolini passive J style pickups, and a three band Bart preamp in need of pots. Have the hard one to get, the push pull pot, but need a balance pot and two 50k tone controls. If you like, I can send them to ya. No worries. It's just sittin, and at moment I have no use for them. Over the years folks have helped me a ton. You can have this stuff if it helps, cuz one, hate to see ya disappointed in that Smith and two, all the help I've recieved I believe in givin back. Is your bass a 4 or 5 string? Or 6? Lemme know what ya think, but I believe the best thing for it would be the Smith stuff. I'm sure he'd work out a deal. But the offer here for the stuff I got. Maybe one day you'll return favor. Parts for this pre amp pretty cheap, I just don't have the gumption ta put it together, and nuttin to put it in.
Dave,

That's generous of you man, and you know, I'll take you up on it! I don't think it'd be worthy not to. I have been helped a ton myself; returned it a few times. I'll remember it and when opportunity comes around, it'll come back to mind.

Ken has offered a re-built pre, and in light of the $ for a new one it's a good deal. It's just that spending anything is just not going to happen for a while here. I suppose things'll change! They tend to.

So that's great- I humbly accept your offer! It's a 4-string, a CR4. I'll pm you... Thank you Dave, you're a gentleman and a scholar!
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  #70  
Old 01-30-2009, 03:04 PM
David Alan McIntire II David Alan McIntire II is offline
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Any time, my friend. I suppose we ought to befriend ouselves on this sight. Make us look less lonely. I've received and replied to your PM, all will happen soon as I can get to everythin. Know what you mean about spendin, I'm not either. Hope this helps ya, and if you decide to let that one go, you know where to reach me. I've got a CR6, my baby, though I've put her through the ringer, not intentionally of course, just things happen over the years when playin every night. I wouldn't change one scuff or remove one ding on this bass' body. It's a special bass, one I know is mine, and was meant for me. I'll tell ya the story some time. But would like you to feel same 'bout yours, then one day you can tell THIS story. Heh.
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  #71  
Old 01-30-2009, 04:51 PM
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Story is in progress Dave. I'll tell it someday! I hope so anyway, I'll tell you at the end of it...
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  #72  
Old 02-10-2009, 09:30 AM
Michael Wilson Michael Wilson is offline
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Default What i would like to see

I would love to see a comeback of the older big black headstock. Maybe just a limited edition model/w the stacked 3 knob controls. That would be nice.
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  #73  
Old 02-10-2009, 10:29 AM
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Lightbulb really?

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Originally Posted by Michael Wilson View Post
I would love to see a comeback of the older big black headstock. Maybe just a limited edition model/w the stacked 3 knob controls. That would be nice.
The big headstock is available by request for an extra charge as we do it by hand.

The 3 knob must be put into 3 of the 5 holes we use now so that when you realize the BMT model is a better circuit, you can upgrade it. The old BT 3 knob route was not upgradable.

We can do it.
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  #74  
Old 02-10-2009, 11:18 AM
Michael Wilson Michael Wilson is offline
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Thumbs up What i would like to see

Well ok then, now that i have it on paper here is going to be my next Smith order NEXT MONTH

1. CR5
2. Flame Maple T&B
3.Mah core
4. Ebony fretboard
5. Big black headstock
6. Gold Hardware
7. Lefty/Str Righty
8. 18 volt pre/BMT

Ken, please give me the cost and how long of a waiting period.

Mike
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  #75  
Old 02-10-2009, 11:43 AM
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Lightbulb well..

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Originally Posted by Michael Wilson View Post
Well ok then, now that i have it on paper here is going to be my next Smith order NEXT MONTH

1. CR5
2. Flame Maple T&B
3.Mah core
4. Ebony fretboard
5. Big black headstock
6. Gold Hardware
7. Lefty/Str Righty
8. 18 volt pre/BMT

Ken, please give me the cost and how long of a waiting period.

Mike
This is regular business. Please email me at the shop. I can give you cost and eta then.

This is almost a standard bass for us with the custom old head. The old heads all had black Phenolic overlays, not wood. Even on the early BMTs. The current way would be to use actual Ebony on the head for the black.
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  #76  
Old 02-10-2009, 01:11 PM
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Default Realization in the wings....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Smith View Post
The big headstock is available by request for an extra charge as we do it by hand.

The 3 knob must be put into 3 of the 5 holes we use now so that when you realize the BMT model is a better circuit, you can upgrade it. The old BT 3 knob route was not upgradable.

We can do it.
+1 Ken. The midrange circuit is key in the mix for any bass.
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  #77  
Old 02-10-2009, 07:16 PM
David Alan McIntire II David Alan McIntire II is offline
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I'm glad to see this thread go this way, one of the main questions I have is concerning upgrading my '95 three band circuit to the new, 18v pre amp. Problem is that I really like the sound of this bass and not sure of the new preamp's sound in comparison. Probably not a ton of difference, and gotta say the new one's design intriguing, with the dip switces and all. I'm assuming a bit more output with the new one, but I'd rather not assume. in fact, don't even know if upgrading mine possible, but that why I'm here. Any here have experience with New vs. Old circuit?
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  #78  
Old 02-10-2009, 09:28 PM
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Default Difference?

If you have the 3 band (i.e. Bass, Mid-range, and Treble) pre-amp, you're good. I wouldn't change a thing unless there was an issue with it. Otherwise, the only difference between the 9V and 18V Pre-amp. are the number of batteries (1 vs. 2) and the Dip Switches. Your not getting more output, you are only getting more battery longevity. The Dip Switches in the 18V provide frequency adjust flexibility, however, I find no need to adjust from Ken's factory settings (old vs. new).

Maybe some day I'll spend more time with different DIP Switch settings (doubtful though). If I need to adjust between 20Hz and 12k, I have all the flexibility from the bass and amp EQ: Not a problem.
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  #79  
Old 02-11-2009, 07:05 PM
David Alan McIntire II David Alan McIntire II is offline
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Man, am glad to hear that. I figured I wasn't missin that much not havin the newer electronics. But ya know how folks get when somethin new comes out. Always tellin me I need to upgrade. I run pretty simple myself, rarely usin the eq at all. Bass sounds so good flat, barely need all the eq options I've got on bass or amp. It is a hair lower output wise compared to my other, 18v equipped basses, so that why aslkin if the newer Smith 18v pre had a hair more output. If that isn't the case, then no need to change. Another question, what impact does the finish of the bass have on its final tone. My bass has the hard finish as opposed to the oil. Is there a difference? My bass' wood grain isn't as flashy as some I've seen here, and though I don't mind, I think my bass has a pretty unique look, just wonderin if that finish may affect the looks of the wood, the sound of the instrument, and how.
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Old 02-11-2009, 07:49 PM
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Cool A hair lower output-wise?

You might want to check and see if you have a gain trim adjustment on your bass' pre-amp. If so, you can bump it up a bit for more output from bass.

Generally speaking, as far as finishes, I've played both. If built right; using quality woods and craftsmanship, I prefer an unfinished (i.e. oil finish) bass. The main reason? 1. I love the feel. 2. I also think the wood responds/vibrates better, thus, giving you more of what the tone woods used can produce naturally.

On the other hand, I also have some basses with clear-coat finishes and wouldn't part with them for anything. Particularly those finishes that are not over-sprayed (i.e. too heavy a clear-coat). While the clear-coat does provide protection, more times than not, I go back to my oil finished basses.

Lastly, you can get a "dud-of-a-bass" whether it is sprayed with lacquer or hand-rubbed-oil finished. This is why it is important to know the craftsman you are dealing with. There are a bunch of instrument builders out there, but few are legitimate Master Luthier's.

Shop wisely!
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Last edited by Tim Bishop; 02-11-2009 at 08:20 PM.
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