Spirocore Red's, Orchestral ??

[Ken Smith]

If anyone has protested Spiro Reds for Orchestral Bowing on line, I was one of them and made no secret of it. So, let me voice my new interest about this.

Years ago when I played in NY using my Old Italian Bass, I used a few kinds of strings from time to time but most often, I used Spiro Reds. I bowed on them just fine and usually used that string on all my other basses as well. I don't think there were Starks on the market yet. I think I heard of Solo/Yellow tips and later on Weich/purple tips but had never used or even seen them that I can recall.

Now, with that said, I have seen a few classical soloists using Spiro Solos and in Europe, I have seen a bass or two with Reds on them, Orchestral players. Now, Belcantos came out only a few years ago so if Reds weren't being used by many in the Orchestras then that would mean Thomastic was selling Spiros to mostly Jazz players. Sounds right? Well, I could easily be totally wrong here on that.

I think here in USA we like that smooth sound under the Bow but many of the European players play with a bit more edge in Orchestras from what I have seen in Youtube videos. Maybe it has something to do with playing their own domestic-like music, maybe not.

A few weeks ago I had some basses come in from Europe to set-up and sell here. One had super high action mainly due to a low overstand on the neck but, it had Spiro Reds on it. The G about 11-12mm and the E about 13-14mm off the end of the fingerboard. By the way, that set-up is about what Virtuoso Bassist Leon Bosch uses. He told me this but when I played his Bass, I saw how that felt. I could barely press the strings down!

So, Mr. Bosch and his action preference aside, this modern English copy with super high actioned Spiros, bowed as smooth as anything. When I sent the Bass with a few others out for set-up with one of the Luthiers I gave him some new sets of strings for the other Basses but said "put the Spiros back on that Bass after you move the Neck out".

Now, on my main personal Bass I have used various sets over the last few years including Flex 92s, Belcantos, Jargar med., Passione Starks and now the new Kaplans, in that order. I have tried at least as many strings that I didn't like for that Bass but those 4 sets mentioned are welcomed any time. Of the others I have tried, they found homes on other basses of mine so nothing went to waste. Also, of the ones I used for just a few months, they went on to other basses.

So now, when these Kaplans wear out of I get tired of them, I think I owe it to my own curiosity to try some Spiro Reds.

I will point out that in the past few years, I have had a few basses come in with Spiro Solos and Weichs as well. They Bowed ok for Spiros on those basses that were however set-up for Jazz but, the tone was too thin for my ears.

So please share your thoughts, opinions, observations or experiences with Spiro reds for Orchestral Bowing.

[Eduardo Barbosa]

Hi Ken,
I play a Romanian 7/8's similar to the one you were selling a while back.
I have used EP's regular and weich, Obligatos, belcantos, Zyex, I stll have on hold a set of Helicore Orchestral, and helicore Hybrid to try out. But for some reason Spiros are the ones that truly wake up that particular bass.
I have that bass mainly for Orchestra, but I like the idea of being able to play the same bass for both orchestra and jazz, just so i can become very intimate with one instrument.
The Spiros a little scratchy at times if I am not real careful. But overall I think they sound great and I was told that out front they sound great, and instead of sounding scratchy out front they just make the bass sound very present.
In general I wasn't satisfied with the other strings because after a while they kind of tended to sound just dark and kind of dull. I still love the EP's and have them on my other bass which is a little smaller and brighter.
I will keep practicing all summer with the spiros, and I'll make the commitment of playing the whole next season on them so i can have a real good idea on how they settle in and perform.
BTW, it's also important to mention that I have two new sets of spiros that I am not currently using. I got the set that I am using on ebay for $23 and apparently it had been used for about 5 or 6 years. It really sounds nice. In fact I had a couple of guys from the Colorado Symphony contact me to see if I had a well used set of spiros that they could get from me. That gave me a clue...

[Richard Prowse]

Ken, is it true that the Kaplans have a fast response under the bow? I'm wondering if Spiro Reds would have a fast response too. The EP weichs are a bit slow. I've been thinking about Spiro reds too as a good classical/jazz string.

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Richard Prowse

Ken, is it true that the Kaplans have a fast response under the bow? I'm wondering if Spiro Reds would have a fast response too. The EP weichs are a bit slow. I've been thinking about Spiro reds too as a good classical/jazz string.

Fast response? I am not sure they do for all set-ups and playing styles. They feel a bit light and I now have the 2nd set on my Marconcini school bass which I hardly use outside of the office. They sound fine but I only played them on three concerts in 3 weeks back to back and one was mostly Pizz. I did the Beeth. 9th first, then the New World and last the Pops thing. Three concerts, three Orchestras. I had my work cut out for me. The 3rd venue was Pops and I used the Amp on a few tunes as well. I just don't know how they will work for Orchestral players that dig in hard as if they are using Original Flex's or the like. So far, I have no complaints. I just have to use them and see what happens.

Spiro Reds are fast and have more tension. For a lower action set-up like I use, I think you can play them harder. The 9th was such a workout, I don't know within a section of 7 basses how the bass itself did. My focus was on the 25 pages of DOTS they call music.

Like I said above, the next set I want to try on my Hart are Spiro reds. I know they take time to break in but I will just have to see. It all depends on how well these Kaplans work and last before I change sets again.

A few years ago I had a French Bass here with Reds on it. It was a screamer of a Bass and the Reds put a spotlight on that as well. Then with a customer here, we switches strings and put the Reds on a 5-string with a high C. Hearing him Bow that bass with Reds was impressive. Even on the bright French bass, the sound under the ear is not the same you hear in the next room. They do deserve some merit. I am just not sure I want to sound like that. I am the one that hears me before anyone else does and being the closest to the sound than any listener is, it can't put me in a panic mode on the first note!

[Richard Prowse]

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

Fast response? I am not sure they do for all set-ups and playing styles. They feel a bit light and I now have the 2nd set on my Marconcini school bass which I hardly use outside of the office. They sound fine but I only played them on three concerts in 3 weeks back to back and one was mostly Pizz. I did the Beeth. 9th first, then the New World and last the Pops thing. Three concerts, three Orchestras. I had my work cut out for me. The 3rd venue was Pops and I used the Amp on a few tunes as well. I just don't know how they will work for Orchestral players that dig in hard as if they are using Original Flex's or the like. So far, I have no complaints. I just have to use them and see what happens.

Spiro Reds are fast and have more tension. For a lower action set-up like I use, I think you can play them harder. The 9th was such a workout, I don't know within a section of 7 basses how the bass itself did. My focus was on the 25 pages of DOTS they call music.

Like I said above, the next set I want to try on my Hart are Spiro reds. I know they take time to break in but I will just have to see. It all depends on how well these Kaplans work and last before I change sets again.

A few years ago I had a French Bass here with Reds on it. It was a screamer of a Bass and the Reds put a spotlight on that as well. Then with a customer here, we switches strings and put the Reds on a 5-string with a high C. Hearing him Bow that bass with Reds was impressive. Even on the bright French bass, the sound under the ear is not the same you hear in the next room. They do deserve some merit. I am just not sure I want to sound like that. I am the one that hears me before anyone else does and being the closest to the sound than any listener is, it can't put me in a panic mode on the first note!

Thanks for that Ken. Ha! I know what you mean about what you hear. I might go with those reds instead of the Kaplans - I don't want Kaplans if I don't get that fast response. I've got my second bass set up with a high C (C G D A) for some solo work I have coming up. I've got an old set of Corelli TX strings on (fairly stiff). The C string certainly sings! Who knows, maybe I'll finish up with reds on both basses (still with one high set)?

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Richard Prowse

Thanks for that Ken. Ha! I know what you mean about what you hear. I might go with those reds instead of the Kaplans - I don't want Kaplans if I don't get that fast response. I've got my second bass set up with a high C (C G D A) for some solo work I have coming up. I've got an old set of Corelli TX strings on (fairly stiff). The C string certainly sings! Who knows, maybe I'll finish up with reds on both basses (still with one high set)?

Richard, I am not saying that the Kaplans are not fast. I just did Beeth. 9th with them on my Hart bass. There are some major fast parts in that piece. They worked great. I was only saying that I don't know what the hard core Orig.Flex. players will or do think about them. They are too new on the market to have all the opinions in. I like them and would be glad to stick with them if nothing else was available. What one string has, another string might lack and visa versa. Not every string does everything. I think they are worth the try. The tone is sweet. My bass likes them!