How high is your bass?

[Richard Prowse]

I'm not talking about substance abuse here. I was watching a video where a guy said that, when standing, the 'nut' (where the strings meet wood at the scroll end) on your bass should be roughly the same height as the space between your eyebrow and hair line. I play with my bass higher than this and have been experimenting with it lower. When a bit lower, the bass balances more easily, but I keep going back to having it higher. Does anyone have one of those golden rules regarding bass height? Gary Karr's bass always seems very high.

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Richard Prowse

I'm not talking about substance abuse here. I was watching a video where a guy said that, when standing, the 'nut' (where the strings meet wood at the scroll end) on your bass should be roughly the same height as the space between your eyebrow and hair line. I play with my bass higher than this and have been experimenting with it lower. When a bit lower, the bass balances more easily, but I keep going back to having it higher. Does anyone have one of those golden rules regarding bass height? Gary Karr's bass always seems very high.

Well, when playing solo like Karr and with a sloped shouldered bass, you can get away with high because you are bringing the solo range closer to the players hands. In Orchestra, the main meat of the playing is under the octave, just the opposite of the solo rep.

Depending on the neck length and broadness of the shoulders (and I play some biggies) I like my first finger, (F on the e-string in half position) to be even with my eye or around there somewheres.. I am most comfortable with that. I do not like raising my hand above my eyes at all. I do that only on the C-extension. Mostly though in Orchestras these days the players sit on a stool and the Bass is at a steeper angle than when standing. Even with sitting thiught the relation from hand to eye stays about there same player to player.

I've played next to one guy for about 3 years that only stood up while playing and he has played in a local orchestra here for 45 years. He can reach across or slightly down and comb his own hair. Talk about having the bass high!

When ever we would have parts that went into the upper positions he would have trouble getting over the shoulders of his Bass and they were slightly sloped. A Czech factory bass made fairly recently (10-20 years old). I told him a few times politely "if you lower your bass to about your eye level, it will be easier to get over the shoulders".

About a few months or so later (maybe less) he sets up next to me on the right (I'm Principal for that Orchestra ) and tells me he lowered his bass and getting used to it, he finds it's so much easier to play now. It took him 45 years to find this out!!

[Richard Prowse]

I was thinking about the balance thing too. The difference I have been experimenting with is probably less than two inches (yankee measurement), but seems to make a huge difference. I agree with your not liking the half position too high. This was the reason why I started experimenting again; I have EPs on and my strings are a little high at the nut - which doesn't feel ideal when walking (jazz). One disadvantage of having it too low is the need to bend more in the high positions - at my age my back needs to be looked after. A young guy like you, Ken, wouldn't have that problem!

[Sam Sherry]

I came up in the Karr school -- I started studies with Leland Tolo, "the other guy" at Hartt when Gary was there and Gary & Tolo were kind enough to let me hang around some master-classes even though I was a rank beginner. I'm sure Gary would chuckle to see my posture now.

Gary's approach to bass-height is part of a deeply worked-out ergonomically-based postural system which is all about maximizing the available musical palette, maximizing muscular efficiency and minimizing risk of injury.

I was taught to play low-F with the first finger pointing at my eye.

Different basses would be adjusted to different heights in order to achieve that result. Consequently, any pictures of Gary with the bass "looking high" are a better reflection of the size of bass than of any desire to "make it high" to project or otherwise.

There are no doubt many others who can speak with real authority about Gary's physical approach to the instrument. I'm just a dubber as we all know and may well have it wrong. All errors are mine; please don't blame Gary, Tolo, Ken Smith or anybody else.

[Richard Prowse]

Originally Posted by Sam Sherry

I came up in the Karr school -- I started studies with Leland Tolo, "the other guy" at Hartt when Gary was there and Gary & Tolo were kind enough to let me hang around some master-classes even though I was a rank beginner. I'm sure Gary would chuckle to see my posture now. Gary's approach to bass-height is part of a deeply worked-out ergonomically-based postural system which is all about maximizing the available musical palette, maximizing muscular efficiency and minimizing risk of injury. I was taught to play low-F with the first finger pointing at my eye. Different basses would be adjusted to different heights in order to achieve that result. Consequently, any pictures of Gary with the bass "looking high" are a better reflection of the size of bass than of any desire to "make it high" to project or otherwise. There are no doubt many others who can speak with real authority about Gary's physical approach to the instrument. I'm just a dubber as we all know and may well have it wrong. All errors are mine; please don't blame Gary, Tolo, Ken Smith or anybody else.

Thanks Sam. Great insightful post!
One question though - when the finger is pointing at the eye (on low F), can this be achieved by the bass being on an angle (sloping towards the player)?

[Richard Prowse]

Originally Posted by Richard Prowse

Thanks Sam. Great insightful post!
One question though - when the finger is pointing at the eye (on low F), can this be achieved by the bass being on an angle (sloping towards the player)?

I've just been trying out the 'finger pointing at the eye' thing and it falls into place with what I've been working on with balance. Hence, I think I'll go with the slightly lower height. Thanks Sam and Ken for your input. I also watched this Gary Karr interview today (it's in four parts) and loved what he said when asked why he was so popular in Japan!
Ciao

[Sam Sherry]

Originally Posted by Richard Prowse

One question - when the finger is pointing at the eye (on low F), can this be achieved by the bass being on an angle (sloping towards the player)?

There are a million ways to play the bass, but that's not consistent with Gary's system as I know (knew?) it.

A basic component of Gary's system is the notion that if the bass is standing by itself the player does not need to use muscular energy (or mental attention) to keep the bass standing. Using Gary's system begins with standing the bass up straight and stepping up to the bass.

Again, all errors are mine. Play on!