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  #101  
Old 08-27-2012, 10:35 AM
Robert Anzellotti Robert Anzellotti is offline
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Originally Posted by JoeyNaeger View Post
Looks great, I was thinking a two piece extension would make routing the string around the scroll easy. Glad to see someone implement it the way I imagined. Here is an extension I finished last night.
Yeah. It would certainly be much more difficult to do a multi-pulley design out of a single piece - at least with my skill level. I was able to do all of the slotting for the string path and pulleys with a table saw. I know most people consider it a crude tool, but I bet I could make a working clock with one if I had to! I chose this piece of purple heart because I knew that with a clear varnish it would exceptionally compliment the red varnish in my Geiger. It will be awhile before I can actually mount it since the bass is in the shop for another repair, but I'll post results when I can.
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  #102  
Old 08-27-2012, 11:55 AM
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Ken Smith Ken Smith is offline
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Originally Posted by Robert Anzellotti View Post


Slideshow:
http://s389.photobucket.com/albums/o...view=slideshow

I still haven't mounted it. Also need to smooth out the varnish a bit. This is the only one I've made from scratch. I ended up with just enough room to bring the string back over the scroll and over a second smaller pulley which sends the string down to the "A" tuner.

Ken, you make a valid point about the sharp ends of the fingers, but the example you saw was very early work. For many years now I have a greatly improved leather wrap, including a larger radius at the end. If this is still not enough, I can on special request wrap a thicker band of leather and make an even softer edge, but everyone out there who uses them seems perfectly happy the way they are. There is an aesthetic thing here too. Some people prefer so see less bulk on their scroll!
Rob, I am all for innovation but for ease of quick flipping them from the edge with a back hand motion, the outer edge of your capos are still at a 90 degree angle and not rounded on the front edge, just around. That is the area I am referring to. Look at the ebony fingers on these examples and see what I mean about rounded. Not the top, but the outer edges.



Here you can see varying degrees of rounding regardless of the mounting method, size or shape of the fingers. If your Capos could be smooth on the edges like these, it would make a world of difference.

The other argument is the tension. You said one full turn was 1/24". Is that correct? If the threads were finer it would adjust that much finer? Correct? Well, if I go from a .105" diameter E-string to a .108" diam. string, I can turn my top screw just a fraction, not a full turn, so it feels the same. With a 1:24 ratio, it would not be possible to adjust .001-.003" as yours have a fixed amount per turn. If I go from .102" to .108" it falls in the middle again. One turn too little and 2 turns too much. I adjust my 'fingers' as the weather changes and the string slightly grooves itself into the finger pads or when I change strings to a different gauge. I think .004166" (1/24th") is a bit hit and miss to get the tension just right if you are finicky about it.

Your newest extension does look nice however.
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  #103  
Old 08-27-2012, 06:30 PM
JoeyNaeger JoeyNaeger is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Anzellotti View Post
Yeah. It would certainly be much more difficult to do a multi-pulley design out of a single piece - at least with my skill level. I was able to do all of the slotting for the string path and pulleys with a table saw. I know most people consider it a crude tool, but I bet I could make a working clock with one if I had to! I chose this piece of purple heart because I knew that with a clear varnish it would exceptionally compliment the red varnish in my Geiger. It will be awhile before I can actually mount it since the bass is in the shop for another repair, but I'll post results when I can.
If I had a table saw, that's how I would do it. A router works fine too. You'll notice Mine goes around the scroll as well, but it's one piece. I took some trickery to make it all work, but the string intunates nicely.Your solution is very elegant looking however. I like how the holes are blind on the one side. Someday I'll do a two piece extension like you've done.
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  #104  
Old 08-28-2012, 05:46 AM
Robert Anzellotti Robert Anzellotti is offline
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Originally Posted by Ken Smith View Post
Rob, I am all for innovation but for ease of quick flipping them from the edge with a back hand motion, the outer edge of your capos are still at a 90 degree angle and not rounded on the front edge, just around. That is the area I am referring to. Look at the ebony fingers on these examples and see what I mean about rounded. Not the top, but the outer edges.

Photos deleted for brevity

Here you can see varying degrees of rounding regardless of the mounting method, size or shape of the fingers. If your Capos could be smooth on the edges like these, it would make a world of difference.

The other argument is the tension. You said one full turn was 1/24". Is that correct? If the threads were finer it would adjust that much finer? Correct? Well, if I go from a .105" diameter E-string to a .108" diam. string, I can turn my top screw just a fraction, not a full turn, so it feels the same. With a 1:24 ratio, it would not be possible to adjust .001-.003" as yours have a fixed amount per turn. If I go from .102" to .108" it falls in the middle again. One turn too little and 2 turns too much. I adjust my 'fingers' as the weather changes and the string slightly grooves itself into the finger pads or when I change strings to a different gauge. I think .004166" (1/24th") is a bit hit and miss to get the tension just right if you are finicky about it.

Your newest extension does look nice however.
Ken, as I said, I could always make a thicker leather wrap and do more roundover. There have been no no requests for this.

Let us separate tension and height. On my latches, tension (rotational resistance) is "set at the factory" if you will, and is unrelated to intonation. Only finger height and to a degree angle of incidence affect where the finger stops on the string.

As for adjustment, the slots in the mounting brackets allow for a lot of movement, so the Capos are plenty adjustable beyond # of screw turns. This is not the case with the E-Stop I concede, but there are ways to deal with this, and all my installers seem to make it work without incident.

As for later intonation adjustments, it doesn't seem to be necessary except when changing string gauge. A dimple presses into the leather during the first days, but the leather doesn't wear or further compress after that. Perhaps it varies from bass to bass, but on my main axe I've had Capos installed for fifteen years, and I've only ever adjusted them when changing string gauge.

My closure system is a significant departure from standard designs, but that doesn't mean it doesn't work

Last edited by Robert Anzellotti; 08-28-2012 at 08:12 AM.
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  #105  
Old 08-28-2012, 05:53 AM
Robert Anzellotti Robert Anzellotti is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeyNaeger View Post
If I had a table saw, that's how I would do it. A router works fine too. You'll notice Mine goes around the scroll as well, but it's one piece. I took some trickery to make it all work, but the string intunates nicely.Your solution is very elegant looking however. I like how the holes are blind on the one side. Someday I'll do a two piece extension like you've done.
You can do alot with a router, of course. Did you channel from the back and then glue in a patch where it touches the scroll? Thinking more about it, this also seems like a good approach, whichever tool you use. Still, you're right. doing a two piece means you've got a nice flat surface against the table. It's gotta be easier!
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  #106  
Old 08-28-2012, 10:01 AM
JoeyNaeger JoeyNaeger is offline
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No, I just did some very careful drilling. One hole from the back of the extension, and then another connecting that hole to the tuning shaft.
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  #107  
Old 07-23-2013, 03:10 AM
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Thumbs up Three more Extensions..

These 3 Extensions were made by Luthier Mike Magee near Pittsburgh, Pa.


These are very well made, as are the other extensions I have gotten from Arnold Schnitzer and Jeff Bollbach. These have very good mechanics but different than both Jeff's and Arnold's work which are different to each other as well. All 3 of these Luthiers now use tunable brackets with hand made ebony fingers.
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  #108  
Old 06-03-2016, 09:00 PM
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Matthew Tucker Matthew Tucker is offline
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Here's an extension I made for my Lott model bass.

The stick is Jarrah, the latches are an extremely hard local desert wood called Doolalia. Harder than ebony.

I chose not to use ebony for the body or fingerboard, as I wanted the extension to look a part of the scroll, not as a chunky addition.
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  #109  
Old 06-09-2016, 06:46 PM
John Cubbage John Cubbage is offline
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Wow! That is a nice design and nice work. It looks like you brought the Long E string around the top wheel for a 180 degree turn, then on a second wheel, diverted the string to the "E string" gear. That trick is new to me.

You have a Lott bass. I recall that Henry Scott of the Philadelphia Orchestra played a Lott bass while he was in the Baltimore Symphony Orchestra prior to his tenure in the Philly. I believe his was of very dark brown varnish.

Very nice job on your extension.

-Dr. C.

Last edited by John Cubbage; 06-09-2016 at 06:48 PM. Reason: changed to the word "prior."
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