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  #41  
Old 11-19-2009, 02:10 PM
Vince Jesse Vince Jesse is offline
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Here are some shots with chromatic stops now in place. I made the brass parts on my little Clausing mill.
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  #42  
Old 03-28-2010, 01:01 AM
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Ken Smith Ken Smith is offline
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Thumbs up nice..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vince Jesse View Post
Here are some shots with chromatic stops now in place. I made the brass parts on my little Clausing mill.
Sorry for the late reply. The hardware reminds me a bit of Arnold's as well as Jeff's brackets. The Fingers look nice and similar as well.
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  #43  
Old 03-28-2010, 01:10 AM
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Ken Smith Ken Smith is offline
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Thumbs up Jacquet goes Chromatic..

Here's some pics of *my Jacquet we took a few weeks ago but were just loaded in recently (*in the process of being sold at the time of posting.)



I have to count carefully how many Chromatic C-Extensions Arnold has made for me. Jeff made 2 so far and will make a 3rd for the Mougenot when it's fully restored...

Ok, counted them.. Arnold has made 6 of them so far including my Panormo school Bass which was just re-photographed to show the extension. I will post that one as soon as Mike loads in the new pics.

Of the 6 from Arnold, 3 of them, the latest made have the adjustable brackets. All of Jeff's do as well. The Hart bass actually has Jeff's brackets but the extension and fingers by Arnold.
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  #44  
Old 04-06-2010, 10:48 AM
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Thumbs up as promised..

My son Mike just loaded the Extension pics last night. the full body shots to follow when he comes back from school in a week of so as the pics are loaded here into my computer.

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  #45  
Old 04-06-2010, 01:12 PM
Geoff Chalmers Geoff Chalmers is offline
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Amazing looking extention! Mike is lucky guy :-)
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  #46  
Old 04-06-2010, 02:03 PM
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Lightbulb Mike?

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Originally Posted by Geoff Chalmers View Post
Amazing looking extension! Mike is lucky guy :-)
That is not Mike's Bass, it's mine!

He just does the web work for me and takes the pictures..
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  #47  
Old 04-06-2010, 04:48 PM
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John Delventhal John Delventhal is offline
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Mario Lamarre extension on my X. Jacquet.

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  #48  
Old 04-06-2010, 05:15 PM
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Thumbs up nice..

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Originally Posted by John Delventhal View Post
Mario Lamarre extension on my X. Jacquet.

Attachment 1530 Attachment 1531 Attachment 1532 Attachment 1533
Nice bass and extension. I remember playing it when you visited. All the best with your new 'old' bass.
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  #49  
Old 04-06-2010, 05:56 PM
Geoff Chalmers Geoff Chalmers is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Smith View Post
That is not Mike's Bass, it's mine!

He just does the web work for me and takes the pictures..
:-) sorry Ken, my brain wasn't engaged when I read your post.
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  #50  
Old 05-24-2010, 09:10 PM
Justin Leonard Justin Leonard is offline
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Default chromatic ebony ext

All ebony ext, sliding nut, was fingered but added capos.
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  #51  
Old 05-25-2010, 01:51 PM
Arnold Schnitzer Arnold Schnitzer is offline
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Justin, how did it feel sinking that last putt to win the British Open? I had no idea you also play the bass!
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  #52  
Old 05-25-2010, 02:36 PM
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Cool C?

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Originally Posted by Justin Leonard View Post
All ebony ext, sliding nut, was fingered but added capos.
This is a C or B ext? The E latch looks off to be in tune. Does it close parallel to the string? Did you save a lot of money using those generic latches as opposed to hand made Ebony ones to match your E closure?

I have tried those on other peoples basses and when I reverse 'ridge hand' it to open them up on the fly they hurt or almost cut me IF I can open them. The rounded Ebony fingers just feel so much smoother whacking them when in a hurry as I don't usually use my fingers as clamps to move them open, just the side edge of my hand/fore finger/knuckle.

This is the first tunable Chromatic Ebony fingers C/X that Arnold made for me using tunable Brackets;
And this is the one Jeff made for me just before that using similar brackets;


Then, Arnold had some more brackets made up and made these two for me back to back;


I've had others made from both Jeff and Arnold and the ones they currently make which have slowly evolved are the best I have seen anywhere as far as function and workability goes. Well worth the difference in price if you are serious about what you put on your bass.
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  #53  
Old 05-25-2010, 03:04 PM
Eric Hochberg Eric Hochberg is offline
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Curious, do the hatpegs get in the way when using the extension?
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  #54  
Old 05-25-2010, 09:56 PM
Justin Leonard Justin Leonard is offline
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Default capo type.

The E latch is open on the picture, its a b-ext. i was playing it and my phone rang so since i was holding bass i leaned it forward and took the pic with my phone. my latches are also adjustable along the extension, they are the ones from basscapos.com which to me look almost exacly like the ones from the american (non-original) stop makers. and the leather on them makes a way better sound than fingered, but i think thats just the bass as it(the bass)was able to play an A with a loosened E string. as far as opening and closing on the fly i usually plan out what stops i'll need and when i forget they aren't a problem to use either my finger or thumb to open. the tension can be adjusted on them as well in case i change to strings of a different tension, i like the ebony stop too but the capos are more flush and i dont have to worry about them sticking out off the side of scroll.the hat pegs arent a problem but i did find on the beeth 5 Allegro (pg 56 if u have the O. Zimmerman complete parts book thats yellow) a slight angle if standing is helpful or sitting works best. its not needed but helps. or fingering 2(E)4(F)2(E)1(D)0(C) works to avoid grazing the hat peg. its original so its not coming off,lol.

I've checked out/played the other materials used for capos especially the ones from Robertsons, and the KC Strings (even the Lamarrio) ones and these add far less weight and dont tilt the bass over (i will mention they are great and should be matched to the players physical capabilities and instrument) . I saved way more money than is posted on most installers websites by getting fingered ext and then deciding to add capos, but according to basscapos.com, alot of widely known shops and installers use them. http://www.basscapos.com/installers.html

Last edited by Justin Leonard; 05-25-2010 at 10:12 PM. Reason: re-read questions
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  #55  
Old 05-29-2010, 10:39 AM
Robert Anzellotti Robert Anzellotti is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Smith View Post
... Did you save a lot of money using those generic latches as opposed to hand made Ebony ones to match your E closure?

I have tried those on other peoples basses and when I reverse 'ridge hand' it to open them up on the fly they hurt or almost cut me IF I can open them. The rounded Ebony fingers just feel so much smoother whacking them when in a hurry as I don't usually use my fingers as clamps to move them open, just the side edge of my hand/fore finger/knuckle.

This is the first tunable Chromatic Ebony fingers C/X that Arnold made for me using tunable Brackets;
Then, Arnold had some more brackets made up and made these two for me back to back;

I've had others made from both Jeff and Arnold and the ones they currently make which have slowly evolved are the best I have seen anywhere as far as function and workability goes. Well worth the difference in price if you are serious about what you put on your bass.
Ken, Ken, Ken... Generic? No, Justin has the real deal installed on his bass. There are some cheap copies out there, like the ones you have on your basses. BassCapos were the first to use an adjustable U-slot design for the mounting bracket. In developing the bracket I worked to create something that was both highly adjustable and aesthetically pleasing. Your copy brackets not only look like a car part, but they donít appear to adjust laterally. This adjustability is important for getting performance just right. You want to be able to angle them a bit forward for higher action and camber, and back a bit for lower, flatter setups.

You talk about sharp edges and hurt fingers. No one else has complained. Leather is actually softer than ebony, if Iím not mistaken. You clearly have a bias toward ebony fingers. Thatís okay. Bassists who feel this way can always use my brackets and have their luthier make the fingers. Also, I have a generous return policy. If my BassCapos were as bad as you say, then I would think that many bassists would have asked for their money back. So far, not a one, and Iíve been selling them for over fifteen years. Ken, youíre all alone out there.
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  #56  
Old 05-29-2010, 11:01 AM
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Ken Smith Ken Smith is offline
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Wink cheap copies?

Ron, Rob, Rob, Rob...You're a funny guy.

My capos adjust finer than your twist around ones.

By Generic I mean you BUY them and put them on. You can't BUY the Fingers on mine from a store. Mine have hand made Ebony fingers, rounded without any sharp edges at the end.

I have played yours and they are not as comfortable to use as mine. Also, the Ebony is lighter in weight than the rubber covered brass. Just check the specific gravity between ebony and brass and compare, please!

You invented the screw type adjustment? Well then, they are copies if that's the case!

It is good for Luthiers out there that can just stick something on an extension and not have to make it by hand. Much much easier to do and cheaper labor wise. It's just not as good in my opinion.

I am not alone out here on this. Most people with professionally made C-Extensions (all of it) are professionally employed and too busy to talk on Forums. Between rehearsals and concerts they have to practice.
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  #57  
Old 05-29-2010, 12:27 PM
Robert Anzellotti Robert Anzellotti is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Smith View Post
Ron, Rob, Rob, Rob...You're a funny guy.

My capos adjust finer than your twist around ones.

By Generic I mean you BUY them and put them on. You can't BUY the Fingers on mine from a store. Mine have hand made Ebony fingers, rounded without ant sharp edges at the end.

I have played yours and they are not as comfortable to use as mine. Also, the Ebony is lighter in weight than the rubber covered brass. Just check the specific gravity between ebony and brass and compare, please!

You invented the screw type adjustment? Well then, they are copies if that's the case!

It is good for Luthiers out there that can just stick something on an extension and not have to make it by hand. Much much easier to do and cheaper labor wise. It's just not as good in my opinion.

I am not alone out here on this. Most people with professionally made C-Extensions (all of it) are professionally employed and too busy to talk on Forums. Between rehearsals and concerts they have to practice.
Ken, Ken, Ken,

Okay, I'll bite.

Adjustability? One turn changes the height by 1/24th of an inch. That is the rough adjustment. From there you can adjust the vertical position or angle of the mounting bracket on the extension via the screws. Your brackets don't seem to offer this flexibility. What do you do for adjustment, add washers?

Weight? I never talked about weight. Sure ebony is lighter than brass, but still I bet my fingers are lighter than yours. My standard finger (including threaded stud, and there is no nut) weighs 18 grams. Also, LEATHER, no rubber!!!

"stick something on"? Well that was the whole idea of my product. Why should a luthier (who is not a machinist or engineer) have to make something like this over and over again, one at a time? Do the best luthiers always make their own endpin sockets or tailpieces? Does doing so improve the instrument? Also, how is it that your copy brackets are not "sticking something on"? Is each unit custom made? They all look pretty much alike too me.

"You invented the screw type adjustment?"
I didn't really invent anything. I was, however, the first to employ U-slots for C-Extension mounting brackets. The idea seems obvious now, but I was doing it commercially for like 12 years before any copies appeared. As far as the "screw adjustment", if you mean adjusting height by number of turns, then I'm still the only one who does it.

"Most people with professionally made C-Extensions (all of it) are professionally employed and too busy to talk on Forums".
Yeah! and many of them are enjoying a high quality closure device - made by me!

Ken, I know that I won't turn you around on your opinion of my product, but I do respect you for letting my posts stand on your forum. I'm probably doing myself more harm than good by writing here anyway, but best wishes!
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  #58  
Old 05-29-2010, 01:26 PM
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Ken Smith Ken Smith is offline
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Cool rob rob rob...

I don't mind at all the discussion or arguments. Some swear the Mechanical Extension is better. There, we stand in the same ditch fighting together. And then, there are the 5-string players telling all of us that Extensions are a cheap fix for not having a 5er.

For me, I like moving the capos without looking when moving fast. If I forget to open the C or any other note, I bend my wrist and quickly slide it upwards along the extension opining all the 'fingers' with my forefinger knuckles near my thumb. In Martial Arts we call this 'ridge hand'. I do it with the fingers pointing down and my wrist up as I hit it back fast opening it in a second or so between notes having forgot to open it before. Even when not forgetting, I use this method to open it so its like a reverse or upside down ridge hand.

Normal hand/fingers like this;

With your Capos Rob, they are a bit small for one and the outer edge with the covered brass shows is sharp or squared there and not rounded or softened around the edges like the ebony fingers. Can you make the fingers bigger and with rounded edges?
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  #59  
Old 05-29-2010, 02:07 PM
Arnold Schnitzer Arnold Schnitzer is offline
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OK, I'll join the fray. Rob, I think your capos are a good second choice for making an extension chromatic. If they were the best thing out there, you'd see Robertson's, Mario Lamarre, Dan Hachez, Jeff Bollbach, Robbie McIntosh and me using them exclusively. I do use your capos on occasion when retro-fitting an existing extension or when a player needs to economize. But I prefer ebony for its aesthetics and feel. If you made brackets that looked as pretty as your current ones, that worked with standard 1/4 x 20 hardware, and they stood off a bit more, I would buy them. I believe there is a place for both pre-made capos and custom ones. Ken has an opinion that you don't like, but the world is full of people who disagree yet get along.
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  #60  
Old 05-30-2010, 10:40 AM
Robert Anzellotti Robert Anzellotti is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arnold Schnitzer View Post
OK, I'll join the fray. Rob, I think your capos are a good second choice for making an extension chromatic. If they were the best thing out there, you'd see Robertson's, Mario Lamarre, Dan Hachez, Jeff Bollbach, Robbie McIntosh and me using them exclusively. I do use your capos on occasion when retro-fitting an existing extension or when a player needs to economize. But I prefer ebony for its aesthetics and feel. If you made brackets that looked as pretty as your current ones, that worked with standard 1/4 x 20 hardware, and they stood off a bit more, I would buy them. I believe there is a place for both pre-made capos and custom ones. Ken has an opinion that you don't like, but the world is full of people who disagree yet get along.
Well, Geez! why didn't you say so before? I'd be happy to make some mounts to fit your needs. I agree that there are advantages to wood fingers. They can be shaped artistically to fit a particular bass, and even a special wood or finish chosen. There are those like Ken who simply prefer a larger surface for finger contact, and some people want a tail so they can have thumb operation. I designed my fingers to be simple, compact, unobtrusive, and universal. It's impractical for me to offer too many options, and I can keep my price low by offering only the single design in two lengths.

Many bassists and luthiers are happy with my finger design (otherwise I wouldn't be in business!) but I realize that this doesn't fit everyone's needs. For them, I encourage the use of wood fingers, which can be easily mated with my mounting hardware. I am happy to sell the brackets by themselves, so the luthier can go wild making the fingers, and not have to worry about machining.

One final note. I use the slightly larger stud because it is not only more stable, but allows for my "internal brake" which eliminates the need for a locknut for resistance adjustment. Also, the threaded approach makes for simpler height adjustment. This makes the assembly simpler (fewer parts), lighter, more reliable, and easier to install than with the traditional approach. I think that these innovations are a step forward on the design side, but I conceed that it also makes later resistance adjustments more difficult. I am no fundamentalist. Arnold, if you want a bracket with a 1/4" thru hole and appropriate races for washers, I'd be happy to accommodate you! Let's talk.
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