german or french or....

[Adrian Levi]

This is my main bass . It is a 7/8 size with a 42,5 scale . There are so many opinions on her origin that for all I know she may be from another world
Any info etc would be really appreciated

[Ken Smith]

Two questions I have for you to start.

1, do you now if that is the original varnish? It looks kind of chippy and not French at all.

2, if you take one gear off each side, can you tell if these gears are original to that scroll or do you see some signs that something else might have been there before?

3, one more for the woofer... Is the varnish 100% the same on the Scroll as the back and ribs as far as you can tell? If it was all stripped and re-varnished, you still ight be able to tell under UV light.

If this is a French bass then I would assume something along the lines of the early 20th century after WWI and a lower grade import (export model from France) by maybe the J.T.Lamy firm. Just like the commercial German factories making export grade products, France did the same thing but on a smaller scale from what I have seen but they DID do it for sure.

[Adrian Levi]

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

Two questions I have for you to start.

1, do you now if that is the original varnish? It looks kind of chippy and not French at all.

2, if you take one gear off each side, can you tell if these gears are original to that scroll or do you see some signs that something else might have been there before?

3, one more for the woofer... Is the varnish 100% the same on the Scroll as the back and ribs as far as you can tell? If it was all stripped and re-varnished, you still ight be able to tell under UV light.

If this is a French bass then I would assume something along the lines of the early 20th century after WWI and a lower grade import (export model from France) by maybe the J.T.Lamy firm. Just like the commercial German factories making export grade products, France did the same thing but on a smaller scale from what I have seen but they DID do it for sure.

I'm pretty sure that the bass has had a 're-varnish' along the way.There are no labels etc , but I'll check to try see if the tuners are original .....

[Adrian Levi]

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

Two questions I have for you to start.

1, do you now if that is the original varnish? It looks kind of chippy and not French at all.

2, if you take one gear off each side, can you tell if these gears are original to that scroll or do you see some signs that something else might have been there before?

3, one more for the woofer... Is the varnish 100% the same on the Scroll as the back and ribs as far as you can tell? If it was all stripped and re-varnished, you still ight be able to tell under UV light.

If this is a French bass then I would assume something along the lines of the early 20th century after WWI and a lower grade import (export model from France) by maybe the J.T.Lamy firm. Just like the commercial German factories making export grade products, France did the same thing but on a smaller scale from what I have seen but they DID do it for sure.

Ok - here are the answers as far as I can see ....

1) It looks like it has been re-varnished at some stage
2) the gears are original to the scroll / there is not a hint of any other covered up holes marks etc !
3) The neck does have a darker varnish than on the body / I am 100% sure that the bass has been repaired along the way ...

I noted that the tuners are of a similar type to a Tyrollean bass I saw on the site ?

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Adrian Levi

Ok - here are the answers as far as I can see ....

1) It looks like it has been re-varnished at some stage
2) the gears are original to the scroll / there is not a hint of any other covered up holes marks etc !
3) The neck does have a darker varnish than on the body / I am 100% sure that the bass has been repaired along the way ...

I noted that the tuners are of a similar type to a Tyrollean bass I saw on the site ?

NO.. Those Tuners on your bass are FRENCH, Mirecourt, 100%.

If the Neck Varnish is different then either they did not re-finish the Neck, the neck was re-varnished during a repair in a different color OR, The Neck does NOT belong to that Bass.

[Adrian Levi]

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

NO.. Those Tuners on your bass are FRENCH, Mirecourt, 100%.

If the Neck Varnish is different then either they did not re-finish the Neck, the neck was re-varnished during a repair in a different color OR, The Neck does NOT belong to that Bass.

OK - I'll contact the previous owner and try to track down more info , I think that she may be helpful in that regard .Thanks so far .....

[Adrian Levi]

Hi Ken thanks for the replies so far ...

I talked to the previous owner and the guy who 're-finished & repaired' the bass and from from all I learned I think that the instrument is stock.
Apparently the aforementioned repair man has varnished this bass on more one occasion!!!!

[Calvin Marks]

Adrian, please don't tell me you get your repairs done by the gentleman 50 miles outside of Joh-burg?! When I was there I saw a bunch of lovely basses including a Hawkes bass that he'd installed a wooden handle on to make it easier to carry! He also told me that he re-varnishes his instruments every 1-2 years!

This was taken in his kitchen (there were two basses also on the kitchen floor). This instrument strangely resembles yours!

[Adrian Levi]

Originally Posted by Calvin Marks

Adrian, please don't tell me you get your repairs done by the gentleman 50 miles outside of Joh-burg?! When I was there I saw a bunch of lovely basses including a Hawkes bass that he'd installed a wooden handle on to make it easier to carry! He also told me that he re-varnishes his instruments every 1-2 years!

This was taken in his kitchen (there were two basses also on the kitchen floor). This instrument strangely resembles yours!

This was taken in his kitchen (there were two basses also on the kitchen floor). This instrument strangely resembles yours![/quote]

Hi Kelvin,I only saw your post now !!! Weird / that could be my bass . The condition does look pretty good though and mine is a little rough around the edges so I wonder ..... The scroll varnish and style looks pretty spot on / do you have any more pics?

Dont worry I'm not taking the bass to the aforementioned 're varnisher' whom I suspect 're varnished' the bass and possibly did some damage to it . What do you remember about the bass if anything ?
Strangely enough the varnisher also put an ugly wooden handle onto it.It is going for an overhaul to a really experienced luthier where hopefully it will get its final finish.

Even stranger is that a Mr G Veffer is doing a job for me !!

[Calvin Marks]

Adrian,

G Veffer? Is his first name Greg? If so, that's my brother in law...What kind of job is he doing for you?

Oi, well if it's that same bass, it had a slew of problems with it. The top was/is sinking in. It sounded really muted because it was completely re-varnished over 4 times in 2 years...Why? I don't know. Also, a handle (wooden dowel) was drilled into the side of the bass on the c-bout for "ease of carrying". Such things should never be done to an instrument.

[Adrian Levi]

Originally Posted by Calvin Marks

Adrian,

G Veffer? Is his first name Greg? If so, that's my brother in law...What kind of job is he doing for you?

Oi, well if it's that same bass, it had a slew of problems with it. The top was/is sinking in. It sounded really muted because it was completely re-varnished over 4 times in 2 years...Why? I don't know. Also, a handle (wooden dowel) was drilled into the side of the bass on the c-bout for "ease of carrying". Such things should never be done to an instrument.

Yep your brother in law doing a cctv installation for me !

Its not the bass in the pic I dont think as I bought it off an orchestral player that had it for almost 4 years , prior to that I know that it had a fairly visible crack in the top repaired,I dont see that in your pic....but Im pretty sure that the aforementioned varnisher got to it at some time !
BTW I hear he is in the process of stripping a 1700's Antonio Gagliano bass as the original finish is now hundreds of years old and needs to be urgently 'updated' before it gets any older

[Calvin Marks]

Originally Posted by Adrian Levi

Yep your brother in law doing a cctv installation for me !

Its not the bass in the pic I dont think as I bought it off an orchestral player that had it for almost 4 years , prior to that I know that it had a fairly visible crack in the top repaired,I dont see that in your pic....but Im pretty sure that the aforementioned varnisher got to it at some time !
BTW I hear he is in the process of stripping a 1700's Antonio Gagliano bass as the original finish is now hundreds of years old and needs to be urgently 'updated' before it gets any older

A Gagliano in South Africa?! I think the nicest instrument in the whole country was Nico Krueger's Hawk's bass, though I don't know what the guys in Cape Town are using.