Upton Basses

[Ron Lacey]

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

What matters is the final product, workmanship inside and out, materials and the final tonal musical results.

I just got back from a 2,000 mile road trip and having lots of time to think I came to the same conclusion. It's not relevant where shop XX gets the raw material, it's the final product that matters and if they're willing to stand behind it, that's what counts.

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

Ah.. did I go off topic here?

Probably, but it's your sandbox . It was a good point just the same. You're fortunate to have a selection of great luthiers to patronize. Out here in the wild west, there's one guy locally - a retired orchestra teacher who did a fine job on a setup on a violin for me a few years ago, but I don't know how his work is on a bass. He might be great, but for my first bass I wasn't prepared to take the risk. Now that I have some idea of what a decent setup should feel and sound like, I might give him a try on a second bass, if I could figure out how to hide a second bass from my wife

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Ron Lacey

You're fortunate to have a selection of great luthiers to patronize. Out here in the wild west, there's one guy locally - a retired orchestra teacher who did a fine job on a setup on a violin for me a few years ago, but I don't know how his work is on a bass. He might be great, but for my first bass I wasn't prepared to take the risk. Now that I have some idea of what a decent setup should feel and sound like, I might give him a try on a second bass, if I could figure out how to hide a second bass from my wife

I would like to hear from Arnold who is not only a player but one of the top Bass Luthiers in the country if not the world. Maybe there are 50-100 guys world wide who do his level of work and maybe only 5-10% can do better. Maybe it would be nice to make a list to see how many are out there BUT they must be at the level to restore old Classic Basses with good proven results.

On the Arnold thing, he has trained two other Luthiers that I know of. One is Zach Martin and the other is Jed Kriegel who works in the shop currently. Jed does great work as I have seen this for myself. Being 20+ years younger than Arnold, we will be looking to him in the future like some New Yorkers now see Gage and Merchant instead of Traeger who trained them decades ago. The trade must be passed on and on.

If your local guy does good set-ups, there is no guarantee he can do good restorations. That's like saying a person can patch a cut on the finger but can he do surgery on your Heart or Brain. In the Medical field they have specialists for every organ of your Body. In Bass restoration, although not as life threatening as medicine, you have one Restorer for everything. It's good to have someone who knows just about everything and who knows your Bass as your Doctor may know your body, hopefully.

[Ron Lacey]

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

If your local guy does good set-ups, there is no guarantee he can do good restorations.

I've never had a bass restored but after reading about the work you've had done, I totally agree. It appears to take both the skill to do the physical work, which looks to be at least a level or two beyond basic setup work, and more importantly, a deep knowledge of the instrument to know what is appropriate to do and what is not.

My local guy may have been fine for setup but the fact that the shop where he works had mostly 1/2 size basses, and the two 3/4 size basses on hand were way overpriced, made me reluctant. They mostly cater to the local school band and orchestra programs. I sure wouldn't take him a restoration without seeing examples of his work. To be fair, I haven't asked him to do any work on my bass and based on his reputation I'd expect him to be up front about what he thinks he can or can't do.

I'd be interested in Arnold's and Jeff's take on how to evaluate a luthier before committing to one; either for setup or restoration. Getting recommendations via internet discussion groups seems to work only for big cities and even those are sometimes scarce.

Now -- that's off topic . Feel free to move some of this over to the Lutherie section since it's independent of the seller of the bass.

[Jeff Gellis]

I have had the opportunity to compare my Upton Hawkes Hybrid to my teacher's 200 year old German carved bass. I started studying with Bassist extraordinaire, Mike Richmond. He played both basses and this is what I heard. FWIW

ARCO
200 year old German Bass - Very mellow top end, there was no lack of top end but it was very easy on the ears. Scooped mid range. That is, has a quality to the mid range that colors the sound in pronounced way. I would describe it as a distinct and unique voice for a double bass. Tight and full lowend. This bass disperses it's sound in a way that surrounds you. You get directionality from the mids and highs but the low end surrounds you, if that makes any sense.

Dec. 2006 Upton Hawkes Hybrid - 20% louder than the fully carved vintage bass, top end was very pronounced. Not obnoxious but not mellow. Midrange and bottom were pretty well balanced but without a distinct complexity or distinct personality. It sounds like a very good bass but not one that you would instantly be able to identify as having a completely identifiable character. This bass disperses it's sound very directionally.

Pizz.
200 year old German Carved Bass - tons of growl- holy cow. Great warm bottom. Midrange uniqueness less prevalent in pizzicato playing.

Dec. 2006 Upton Hawkes Hybrid - once again, substantially louder. More punch in the low end. I assume that's a function of the loudness difference. Brighter than the German Bass.

Conclusion
In the hands of Mike Richmond, that carved German bass sounds rediculously good. The distinct and complex character of the sound make listening to it a joy.
The Upton sounded very good. I mean very good. Not complex but still very musical and pleasing.
I guess a Beaujolais Noveau vs a fine red at it's prime would be the best comparison I can come up with. Certainly, not junk by any account and I will be able to grow musically with this bass.

[Greg Clinkingbeard]

Jeff,
Very interesting comparison and similar to my experience as well.
My teacher has two basses.
One, a 19th century carved bass, probably German. My Hawkes is much louder and fuller sounding, although it lacks the deepest fundamental of the older bass.
The other is a 7/8 carved Rodier that Bob Branstetter played for many years, so it is tuned to perfection. Both basses are wearing Obligatos at the moment. The Hawkes is about equal in volume and has a similar tonality, but lacks in a couple of areas. First, the Rodier is quicker. It has a pronounced edge to the attack where my bass is quite a bit slower. Second, my bass lacks the complexity of tone of the older and much more expensive bass. That said, In the few times I've been able to compare side by side, the Hawkes holds its own quite well.

One of these days or months I'll leave it with Bob for a few days to see what he can do to improve it, but I'm in no hurry. For a new bass it feels and sounds pretty darn good, especially for the price.

[Jeff Gellis]

Greg,
In my opinion, my bass got a lot better sounding after luthier Bill Merchant, got his hands on it. He moved the bridge a bite, he moved the sound post forward (towards the neck) approximately 1/2 inch. The bass came alive. This stuff is so subjective but my bass definatly sounded better than the way it came from the Upton Shop. I think your bass might benefit from having Bob do his thing too.

[Michael Case]

I don't wanna come off the wrong way, but I need to ask this question for my own satisfaction. If Upton has these basses built in a factory in Romania and all they do is varnish, add fingerboard, bridge, soundpost, end-pin, and set-up. What makes these basses so different than any other factory bass (hybrid or carved) in the same price range set-up by the luthier of your choice.

I'd like to know because I'm sort of considering a Professor bass or saving a bit more scratch and getting a NS LaScala Hybrid or carved if possible.

[Jeff Gellis]

Two years since I started this post. A lot has changed. Still studying, playing at a much higher level, I have heard many, many other bassists and basses since the original post. Here is my new review of the Upton Hybrid bass I have had since January 2007.

This bass gets better sounding all the time. Both classical players and Jazz players have had great things to say about both the pizz and arco sound of my bass. It bows well, sounds present and even and sings throughout the entire range of the bass. It lost it's overly bright edge it had when it was new but remains present and warm. It is easy to hear when playing in a section as the whole bass resonates making pitch easy to hear/feel. Action is on the lower side of normal yet it still bows well. Pizzacoto is punchy and aggressive, great for grooving and walking. Its produces very loud and clear fundamentals.

As many have pointed out, there are other basses in this price point. I will tell you that mine is a winner. It gets noticed sonically and it keeps getting better. I have no affiliation with the manufacturer, this is 100% straight and honest take on a bass which I now have some history with, am getting to really know and love.