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Old 09-27-2010, 01:21 AM
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Bin Hire Bin Hire is offline
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Default Playing and improvining fast 8th notes.

The bassist on this clip (the second one)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9xf-...ext=1&index=24
is running 8th notes at roughly 336bpm when he solos.
I've watched it quite a few times and can get my right hand up to speed for a short time. No doubt practice will make my playing stronger and the time longer. I have practised the same three finger technique.
Here is my question.
What would members of this forum suggest to get my left hand playing good notes?
I am working with a metronome and varying the speeds from slow to faster.
Thank you.

Last edited by Bin Hire; 09-27-2010 at 01:22 AM. Reason: Spelling. Very sorry.
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Old 09-27-2010, 10:32 AM
Eric Hochberg Eric Hochberg is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bin Hire View Post
What would members of this forum suggest to get my left hand playing good notes?
You have to hear the "good" notes you want to play and figure out how to play them. Start slow and work your way into faster tempos. Kind of like using good letters when we write.
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Old 09-27-2010, 11:52 AM
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Lightbulb Play fast?

Fast left hand requires loads of practice. Intonation is harder than faster even at slow speeds. Practice with the Bow. Learn all of Simandl and every other book like it. Learn the Dragonetti. Practice what you can of those with Pizz as well but Bow first. The fingers can't play what the left hand can't.

Get a Teacher that is a professional Orchestra player. It will make a world of difference. Been there, done that.

I lost some speed but gained accuracy. I made more money as a pro player in NY with the accuracy. The speed didn't pay so well!

I actually prefer the feel and tone of Ray Brown to the sound and speed of NHOP. He is great but I would rather listen to Ray if I had to choose between the two. Don't get sidetracked by speed. Find some clips of Ray Brown and study him musically before you start the race. Walk, don't run!
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Old 09-28-2010, 04:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Hochberg View Post
Start slow and work your way into faster tempos. Kind of like using good letters when we write.
Thank you Eric. Very poetic.
Thank you too Ken. I am humbled to learn from your vast experience.
I don't think that I will ever get to be a pro player in New York. But I listen to what you say.
Here is a thought. I watch NHOP and wonder why one person can perform at this speed and another not. My hand is not unlike his. Okay you will say to practise a lot! Yes but there is something else.
Persistence? Self belief?
I don't think I have the self belief to do that. I think that is what I must change.
If I were to be successful at playing at this speed it would be a test of achievement. Did I succeed? Did I fail?
How does one play a beautiful improvised melody? Yes one must have something worth saying. But one must also have the confidence that it is worth saying. If one believes in one's self, one plays better yes?
Confidence comes from testing boundaries.
Thank you.
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Old 09-29-2010, 02:29 AM
Richard Prowse Richard Prowse is offline
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Bin,
I love that clip!
Both bassists are great!
The changes to Sweet Georgia Brown ((1st 16 bars (4 chords without the turn around) - any key)) are a good starting point for running 8th notes at fast tempos. Vary the tempos - from fast to slow/ slow to medium/medium to fast, etc. Also, try the 8th notes with a bow, it's actually easier! In my opinion 240bpm is a good median point to aim for at first. If you're playing those changes at different tempos, you'll probably discover that you are also exploring note possibilities almost by default. Try to make it fun - that never seems to hurt!
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Old 09-30-2010, 03:34 AM
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Richard what strings are you using?
Are stiff or soft strings better for fast pizzicato?
I thank you sincerely for your advice.
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Old 09-30-2010, 03:43 AM
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Sorry, after posting I just read this thread.
http://www.smithbassforums.com/showthread.php?t=1393
Are you still using Bel Cantos?
I have Weichs at present.
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Old 09-30-2010, 04:05 AM
Richard Prowse Richard Prowse is offline
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Hi Bin,
The Weichs and the Bel Canti are quite similar for pizz., though the Bel Canti could be a little more flabby. I suspect that firmer strings are probably more suited to fast pizzicato, but the Bel Canti are good for my bowing stuff. I've been practising quite a bit lately and believe that, with heaps of practice, good results can be achieved with most strings.
I started, on a whim, putting my Weichs back on my carved bass today but, surprisingly, the Weich E string vibrated against the fingerboard. I think that my E string setting might be a little too low - but it works for the Bel Canto E. I was feeling that maybe the Bel Canti weren't projecting for pizz., but then I saw a DVD of a trio I play in and these strings sounded very good. The Bel Canti are staying.
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Old 10-02-2010, 11:52 PM
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I agree that the bow is easier to play fast 8th notes. It seems like we're working in tandom. I was playing 8th notes today at about 300bpm. Still work to do though. Sometimes my note choices were the easiest ones.
Nice to compare notes.
Thank you.
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  #10  
Old 10-14-2010, 02:31 AM
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Terry McDougal Terry McDougal is offline
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Thumbs up Interesting thread!

I like to push the limits, like when I'm working with a metronome. Sometimes I feel that pushing your technique to extremes leads you to discover other things.
Maybe, while pushing the tempos, one might think about how tone is effected at different speeds? This may lead you to centre some attention on your tone.
Maybe, if one is playing at a tempo too fast to run 8th. notes, one might centre in on the quarter notes and locking them into the time?
Hey, but I'm from Aberdeen.
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Old 10-14-2010, 03:50 AM
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Terry I think I understand what you are saying. I like the idea. The whole of your playing draws from the parts. You are saying that practice is the same. At least that is what I think you are saying. Apologies if I am wrong. So your playing is like an entity? The sum of all the parts? What you add pushes the boundaries like air being blown into a balloon.
Thank you for your thoughts on this topic.
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Old 10-15-2010, 06:00 PM
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I've just been practising quavers between 240bpm and 336bpm. Half an hour's practice, pizzicato. I was inspired by this thread. I can run the notes at 336bpm for a very short time and try to keep the beat going with crotchets as I recover. Really I think the trick lies in getting your left hand there on time and getting it pressed firmly. My right hand feels quite tired now so maybe I am building up strength.
Ah, fast notes! Everyone is in a hurry in Aberdeen!
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