Jerome Thibouville Lamy Bass?

[Nelson Cascais]

Hi

I´m interested on buying this bass and I would like to know if it´s really a Lamy and the estimated value on the market.
The seller says that it´s a Lamy circa 1880.
And how about this bass maker? I know Bernardel, Vuillame and Jaquet but
I don´t know anything about Lamy.
I didn´t try it yet cause I´d have to travel so I want to know more about it before.
I play jazz.
The seller is asking 9000€, 13400 USD aprox.

Thanks!

Regards
Nelson

[Arnold Schnitzer]

At that price you are stealing that bass. Please contact me if you don't buy it, so I can. Oh wait, this is Ken's forum, I guess he gets first dibs.

[Eric Rene Roy]

LOTS of info out there on JTL. Search Google...tons of info.

[Nelson Cascais]

Thank you!

[Ken Smith]

I think it is important to realize that a Lamy bass is more of a factory made instrument than something hand made. I saw in a 1920-1930ish wholesale catalog Lamy Basses offered for some very low prices in competition with the German made instruments of that time.

Being machine carved in a factory you can expect the bass to be very heavily wooded inside which will affect the tone. Fully re-graduated plates will improve the sound but restoring and improving a bass like this will cost in the thousands even if you don't have a single crack to fix.

The String lengths are often long on these Cello shouldered basses and the neck sets less than desirable. I currently own a Vuillaume style bass by Mougenot that is in restoration. This bass is totally hand made and the graduations are actually good as left by the maker. The Bass is long and the neck must be replaced and reset to achieve a better playing length.

These basses average 42-43" (107-109cm) string lengths on the ones I have seen and I would say closer to 43" (109cm) in most cases. These Basses were the full sized orchestra instruments in their time from what I can tell. The reason you see these used in Jazz is because the tone produce is usually less than desirable under the bow.

If you are considering one of these basses, make sure you understand exactly what this is and the costs involved if you want to bring it up to par with a hand made version of a similar Vuillaume style model as this one is.

In my opinion and I stress that opinion part, a bass that is good for jazz and not for orchestra has a much lower value, period. If good and desirable for orchestra and all the work done to make it optimum for playing, then the value is much higher.

I would also caution you as to the date of this bass. I think that 1880 although possible seems a bit early for the condition. Also, the fact that they were making these well into the 20th century, one must consider that post WWI 1920-1930 is equally possible as well. That being said, the 40-50 year difference in the estimate would definitely affect the value as in the eye of the market, it becomes 20th century and not 19th century. Not a hundred years, but in text, it seems so.

One thing you cannot get away from are those broad Cello-like shoulders. I do see Orchestra players using them but just about everyone I have talked to that owns one wishes they could have a more friendly upper register for solo playing. France did produce an extreme sloped shoulder model in the same period but not much in between. Those basses have a different set of problems for orchestra due to the size and shape. Nanny however did endorse this as solo playing on the bass back then was booming. Unfortunately, the tone wasn't!

Be careful and good luck with your search.

[Nelson Cascais]

Hi Ken

Your post is very elucidating. I´ll be very carefull.

The mesurements of this Lamy bass are:
String length: 105.5cm; back 113cm; upper bouts 53.5cm; lower bouts 69cm; ribs 20cm tapering to 17cm.

The owner says that he has been using it for orquestra work.

I´m gona ask him to mesure the top thickness.

Thanks
Regards
Nelson

[Arnold Schnitzer]

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

Being machine carved in a factory you can expect the bass to be very heavily wooded inside which will affect the tone. Fully re-graduated plates will improve the sound but restoring and improving a bass like this will cost in the thousands even if you don't have a single crack to fix.

Ken, I think you paint Lamy basses a bit one-dimensionally. I have seen Lamy's that would compete with anything in terms of workmanship and sound. There is a magnificent one in National Symphony (you can see its lion-head scroll on my website). The plates on that bass are not thick, the detail work is excellent, and overall I'd give the bass a spirited thumbs-up.

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Arnold Schnitzer

At that price you are stealing that bass. Please contact me if you don't buy it, so I can. Oh wait, this is Ken's forum, I guess he gets first dibs.

I also noticed this exact same bass here in the states now at another shop. I hear that it is selling now for quite a bit more than it was going for in Europe. Perhaps that dealer saw it here and went after it for his inventory. Maybe!