Confirmed?
 

I don't know all of who made what for Vuillaume but he employed many makers for Violins, Cellos, Basses and Bows as well. With his business and traveling I doubt that he made much of anything all by himself.

How do you confirm who made a bass if there were reportedly 3, 4, or 5 different makers that over time made these for him? If my Mougenot didn't have a label inside it would be attributed to Vuillaume as well. It has the same FFs as found on other Basses with his mark. Mougenot worked for and took over the shop of his brother Nicholas F. Vuillaume who reportedly made basses for JB when he worked with him before moving to Brussels.

So, is the Haden Bass a Vuillaume 'ordered' 'made' 'shop' 'contracted' bass or a bass made totally by the hand of JB? I have no idea. Also, at one time in France the 'Guilds' were in power in the violin field so Varnish, Scrolls and violin making were done by separate certified craftspeople.

Well then why call anything by it's name? There is really no way to know if any bass was made by the name on the label, right?

why?
 

You mentioned a 'confirmed' Vuillaume. It was the 'confirmed' part I was referring to as with this maker, the Basses are more than likely from others.

He had a fairly large shop and output. I am sure his model, quality and varnish was closely followed under his or someones watchful eye but I doubt he made all the instruments bearing his name.

Some makers worked alone. Vuillaume was far from that. Some had an assistant or two, three or more. Who knows? I was just again responding to the 'confirmed' mention.

Speaking of Vuillaume - I believe he was the one who actually made the Octobass.

Right. It's been written, referring to the violin trade, that 90% of labels are fake. Some experts, however, can tune in to a particular maker's handwork, style, model, f-hole, etc., and provide an appraisal that is above reproach. Then again, certain violins known as Strads for the last century or so, have recently been "proven" to be English, from a Century later.

There is a big difference between "made by", "from the shop of", "school of", and "in the style of". Unfortunately, all this vagueness makes buying an expensive instrument a bit un-nerving, which is why one should always seek out multiple opinions from practitioners one can trust. As far as "Vuillaume" basses go, like Ken said above, I would put them in the category of "from the shop of".

fake labels..
 

Ok on the 90% BUT that includes the many thousands of Violins made in the 19th century with various names inside, Strad leading the group.

In the case of basses and aside from the obvious factory made instruments, I don't know if 90% is correct. Maybe if you add in the false attributions you can get to that number. I have however found a few authentic basses over time but everything is suspect at the start.

Newer makers are easier to find as those names are not old enough yet to be used for fakes. On the other hand, if it's a famous name, it can be used. Many late 19th century thru early and mid 20th century Italian names are being found in violins thru basses today made anywhere from Hungary to even Italy. It is much easier to fake 50 or 100 years than 200-300 years or more.

An Italian bass from the early 20th century being sold for less than a factory Juzek is very suspect regardless of condition. Within that 90% number, the Juzek basses help push that percentage to its top because there is no such thing as a bass made by Juzek and there never was. They are all fakes or more politely, a brand 'sold by'. imported by' and maybe, a slight maybe, designed by'.

When I bought my Martini from Italy Arnold asked me to make sure it's not a fake because it was very possible. When he saw it in person shortly after it arrived, all suspicions were removed. It was the real thing. Lucky me..;)

With Vuillaume, I hear that name used so much as if he specialized in Basses. How can you tell a French Bass, 'false' cello model, round or flat back bass from the makers like Bernardel, Claudot, Derezay, Gand, Barbe, Jacquet, Lamy etc. IF, they all look so alike. Not to mention, some of the scrolls and varnishes were made within the guild trade as required by law then.

I heard of a beautiful Lamy getting restored and when it was nearly done, the Shop owner put in a Gand label to sell it for more. Who could tell?

True, most are pretty decent...:D

sucH
 

SucH... Just a Typo funny guy.. Most are decent as compared to what?

Umm... as compared to the rental and loaner basses I have to play on fly dates when my Juzek isn't with me? :rolleyes:

Fortunately, mine is with me tonight in Hutchinson, KS. Unfortunately, I had to drive for 13 hours for that to happen - and then 13 more hours tomorrow to get back to Nashville. :(

hello,this picture to "médiatheque cité de la musique" is a "copie Stradivairus" from JB Vuillaume...elle appartenais au bassiste Anglais Edward J. Merritt,le fond de la caisse Ã* été agrandi par Gand et Bernardel ,j'ai moi meme une Vuillaume dont voici des photos

bonsoir benjamin

tres belle contrebasse!
do you have some more infos about it?

Guten Tag Anselme
désolé de vous ecrire en français ... cette contrebasse viens de l, atelier de JB Vuillaume Entre 1830 et 1840 d'apres le luthier français JF Schmitt. je n'ai pas plus d'info, la contrebasse appartenais au bassiste Canadien J Quarrington

another photo to my Bass Vuillaume

another picture to Bass Vuillaume "Sainte Cécile" in the "Musée de la cité de la musique "in Paris and the last picture is the Bass Vuillaume owned by Vincent Charbonnier

bonsoir benjamin
i´m sorry, but my french is not the best :o, could you please write that in english too? thanks :)
(and maybe ken wants to know it too :rolleyes:)

do you know anything about the st. cecile i posted here http://www.smithbassforums.com/showthread.php?t=618
in posts # 7,17,18? (i bet you recognize the shop...:cool:)

merci!

Vuillaume
 

Thanks for posting the photos of the Vuillaume (not the St. Cecile). It's exactly like one that I saw several years ago. There are many of the red ones that were made in Mirecourt sometimes with impressive names but most of the time not labeled at all.