Ken, I just noticed on the 19th Century Italian that the owner let you photograph (http://www.kensmithbasses.com/double...t_Italian.html) has the strings wound on the tuners in a normal C extension method instead of how you normally see it without an extension. Was this done because the person is normally used to a C-extension or is there some benefit to doing it this way?

Ext E peg..
 

Many players who have C-Ext's on other Basses string their non ext. Bass the same way so the E and A is always in the same place.

Personally, I think it opens the sound up a bit as well extending the after length. The Candi Bass is now strung that way as well and sounds great. The web pics of the Candi were taken before I switched the A and E around on the pegs. My Storioni is strung that way as well.
http://www.kensmithbasses.com/double.../scroll_fr.jpg

I just switched the A and E strings from their normal respective pegs on my school's carved Juzek, I have to say that I am now a believer of this method.

In their previous "normal" positions, the A string lacked power and volume while the E string had decent power but felt really tight. Now, the A string is feels much tighter and has a good deal more volume. It feels and sounds very similar to the D string now. The E feels and sounds much looser and pliant now with the longer afterlength. But the biggest benefit of the switch is that the E has a much broader and bigger bottom. Playing it open, it now sounds almost organ-like, though perhaps a bit less direct.

I love the sound up close, but I don't know what it sounds like far away (which I think is more relevant to the audience). But for now, count me as a convert.

I also had problems with a harsh G string, so I put a Pirastro rubber tone filter on my G string. Meh, give me a couple of days, but I think it sounded better without it. I've been told that a soundpost adjustment may be the reason the bass seems to hate G strings (I've tried a Flexocor, Original and '92, and I've tried an Obligato; they all had a twangy guitar quality to them. The current Helicore orchestral seems to work best so far). I really need to get this bass setup one of these days.

E&A reversed..
 

It's not just the length change when switching, it's also the angle of pull. The A-string is now a much sharper bend and the 'E' is shallower than before. Considering the thickness of the E-string (.105 avg) combined with the normal sharp angle pull, the switching to the upper peg is a drastic change. Perhaps the 'freedom' given to the string when moving it to the A-peg reflects back in the sound and tension as well.

E&A strings reversed..
 

I moved this from the 'Candi Sale' thread over to here as it is a completely different topic discussion...

Will unwinding the E & A at the same time reduce enough pressure to let the soundpost fall, or should it be ok? I'd like to test this on my bass.

very interesting topic,

i once have seen a bass that was strung this way (see picture). now i begin to understand why

maybe..?
 

Lie the Bass down carefully and loosen the D and G slightly as well so the Bridge doesn't try lifting. The Post is held more by the G and D than the A and E but be careful of bridge movement while doing this. In the winter, the Post is usually tighter.

wow..
 

Now that's drastic. The thickest string the highest and the thinnest the lowest. Looks like some re-learning is in order here as far as tuning goes. Still, I turn the wrong peg on occasion as not all of my 'E' are up high, just most of them. Also, I spent my whole life with the E being the lowest so even if all the Basses are strung the same, in a pinch I grab the wrong tuner.

Eh, this is Orlando....we don't get winters :D

string order
 

I recently saw a bass strung following a theory that the lowest string should have the longest distance at the pegbox. Therefore i think only the A stays in normal position, the E goes where the D usually is etc. A pro player here who is also a luthier was working in Paris a few months back and visited a shop where he found all the basses even the cheap ones sounded and played so well and he noticed that they were all set up like this. He tried it when he got home and swears his bass sounds and plays better than it ever has. Haven't tried it myself - anyone else?

Actually, I think whether this orientation will work or not depends from bass to bass.

On my bass, the A string in its "normal" position sounded pretty weak and flabby, while the E string had more bite to its sound but felt too tight. But in their current positions, (E on the A-peg, and A on the E-peg) they sound much better. The A string feels much tighter now and sounds more direct with more bite, while the E feels much looser and sounds more sonorous with a nice low end. I've mentioned all this in my post above.

So basically, you can string your bass in the manner you described above; it will probably improve your sound overall. But I think the best way to decide if this is right way for you is to listen to your current setup and figure out which strings need improvement and how.

I find that a shorter after-length combined with a sharper angle where the string crosses the nut leads to a brighter sound that has more bite, as well as a tighter feel to the string. A longer after-length with a gentler angle leads to a more sonorous and richer sound, as well as a looser feel. However, a longer after-length can also lead to a weaker and flabbier sound, so be cautious about that.

i took the photo in paris, maybe it´s the same shop?

(but the bass in the pic didn´t sound that good to me)

Has he also tried a compensating tailpiece? If on that bass it works at one end of the string, its probably going to work extending the afterlength at the other end ... and maybe easier to install and get used to tuning ...

http://www.smithbassforums.com/attac...1&d=1201522735

Anselme, that's an interesting pegbox with its open back - don't see them very often. Also the spacing of the machines in two "pairs". Do you remember what bass that was? I've only see machines installed like that by another local maker.

it was a vuillaume st. cecile. (at least that´s what the luthier said...)
i have some more pics if you´re interested

Love to see more pics!

ok matthew, here we go.

iirc the bass had on original string lenth of 98cm (38,5")
the luthier changed the neck, now it has 108cm (42,5")
i will not comment this, if you have your own opinion what a well proportioned bass is, well...:o

the sound was a little to harsh and bright for my taste.

i´m not sure if its a real vuillaume. although the st. ceciles were a kind of economyclass-instruments, this one seems to be too less accurate made, imho.

i am courious what ken (and arnold?) will say.

three more pics

Thanks for posting those Anselme

That is one peculiar looking bass, particularly around the neck region. Kinda looks like a regular bass with a "cello" style top stuck onto it. Is all that carving (double button etc) all part of the design, or is it a result of a reconstruction somehow?

From the side, the neck heel looks rather weird ... how to be sure where your D stop is with such a wide heel curvature!

looking again at those machines, they can't be original? sure looks to me like the whole pegbox has been reworked in an "individual" way.

mt

Is all that carving (double button etc)??
 

Matt, you need to get out more. That is THE typical 19th century French Bass, Violincello model. It may have originated as a design by Vuillaume but I see it on just about every French makers Violin cornered Bass from about 1850-1900.