" Name That Bass " aka "This OLD Bass"

[David Powell]

Originally Posted by Matthew Tucker

Can you explain to me what you see as similar, except that it's a shade of orange and worn in spots? I'm not being facetious; I just can't understand how anyone can see a strong similarity - inferring I suppose that it could be in fact the same varnish - from two small photos taken in different light?? Educate me.

Varnishes and finished wood are notorious for being difficult to photograph accurately, however, the same varnish will always photograph the same way under the same light, in my experience (given the same film or in these days, the same digital camera). I have photographed quite a bit of finished wood professionally, so I have years of first hand experience. One of my clients was Signature Interior Woodworks. They were often tasked with matching a new finish to an old one. This was difficult and getting the two to look the same in a photograph was practically impossible even if the two looked similar to the eye. Vary the light source and it might get better or worse.

What is fairly determinative in this case is that many finishes that appear similar to our eye will not appear similar at all when photographed. Cameras just don't see things the same way our eyes do. The dye peak sensitivities of film or digital cameras are not at the same frequencies as those of our eyes. This means that if two things look the same to our eyes and look the same to a camera or to film, it is even more likely that the substance is the same chemical formulation. Chromatography is a process by which color absorption or reflection is used to definitively identify substances. This is an abbreviated explanation, but covers the concept.

You asked for an education!

[Michael Harrison Jr.]

I really like the cocobola TP, but I think the 3 string TP would look best on that bass.

[Ken Smith]

Here's the other TP that Mike made for my converted 5er I used to have. Sorry in advance that I don't have a close-up of it. I don't remember now if it was Cocobolo or Macassar Ebony which was from my own stock that I supplied to him.


He makes great Tailpieces.

[Michael Harrison Jr.]

very pretty.

[Matthew Tucker]

Originally Posted by David Powell

What is fairly determinative in this case is that many finishes that appear similar to our eye will not appear similar at all when photographed. Cameras just don't see things the same way our eyes do. The dye peak sensitivities of film or digital cameras are not at the same frequencies as those of our eyes. This means that if two things look the same to our eyes and look the same to a camera or to film, it is even more likely that the substance is the same chemical formulation. Chromatography is a process by which color absorption or reflection is used to definitively identify substances. This is an abbreviated explanation, but covers the concept.

You asked for an education!

So what you are saying in an abbreviated way is that because in two small digital photographs the varnish looks a similar colour to you, even though you have not seen the originals to compare or contrast (as Ken has), and even though your eyes are looking at a digital photograph (which is different to the way your eyes see it anyway) you can still see a really strong similarity in the varnish of the MB and the Hill bass, and this is equivalent to chromatography in that absorption or reflection is used to definitively identify substances, leading you to believe that it is quite likely those two varnishes are the same chemical formulation?

[David Powell]

What I am saying is, of course, what you quoted.

I am not saying that Ken's by eye comparison and my comparison of two digital photograph (size is not important where colour is concerned) is equivalent to chromatography. It is based on the same principle though much cruder. To me the varnishes look similar.

[Ken Smith]

I moved David's post and all the related replies about his Bass to the German School section "Another mystery bass?". Please follow that thread over there.

If any of what I moved belongs here as well in your opinion, please feel free to copy n paste it and re-post it here as well.

[Ken Smith]

I just tried something interesting here. I drew in violin corners on the Back here and cut it out. I curved in the upper bout above the corner and the lower bout below the corner making violin corners. The upper corners are more pronounced than the lower corners but it has Violin corners now on my pics.

Can anyone here photo shop violin corners in and post it here? This is the Back and try also to do the top. Looking at it with corners make it looks so different.



When I have time, I will ask my son Mike to help me post what I have done as well.

[Ken Smith]

I talked with Biase earlier today and he sees the original golden varnish under the over-varnished dark red on the Scroll. What does this mean? Well I have updated our opinion to read; "The Maple Scroll, although varnished over in dark red is most likely original to the Bass as it matches in character as well."

[Ken Smith]

I just posted this in the Yankee thread but it actually ties both threads together as Yankee was one of the origins guessed on this Bass and by more than one person.

Can anyone here post a good scanned pic of the Elgar Calvin Baker Bass so we can compare it here. I am mainly concerned with the FFs.

Here is my post from the Yankee thread;

Has anyone here ever seen a Bass by Calvin Baker? There is one pictured in the Elgar book and looks like a German Gamba design.

C.Baker trained and/or worked with Asa White. I have seen a Bass that was by Asa White the same day I dropped off my Mystery Bass at Biase's almost 4 years ago and only vaguely remember the Bass. It was a small 3/4 or 5/8 and had a dark varnish and a Flatback.

I have mentioned before that the Scroll on the 'White Bass although smaller to match the Bass was nearly identical to my Scroll which is on a full sized Bass.

Although my Bass has some English features as well as an early French style outline, American has also been guessed on it several times but with no match other than the White Scroll and by the way, the FFs on the C.Baker Bass which look close.

One of the reasons I never considered New England as a real possibility was became I have never seen an American Bass as European looking as mine. The thing to know here is that the Boston and NY school of Violin makers were mainly European immigrants that trained in Violin making before coming to USA. Both Asa and Jay White though were trained by their father John who made about 12 or so violins and is noted as the first Violin Maker in Boston but an amateur. Jay and Asa are I think credited as being the first professional makers in that area. The Gemunder Bros. George and August came later. George from France and August from German. Both initially trained by their father in Germany. George also worked for Vuillaume before coming to USA.

One thing that concerns me is that many of the Basses in the Elgar book are falsely listed. He accepted pictures in the mail with any named attribution and published it as fact. The 5-String Gagliano Bass is actually an English Bass and has been sold at least twice since as an English Panormo by one of the sons. One of the large d'Salo Basses listed that's in a Canadian Museum is old Brescian but not d'Salo.

Can anyone here post a good scanned pic of the Elgar Calvin Baker Bass? (not the William Baker, that's English and it's the real deal as well)