9-1-1, 9-1-1, 9-1-1, Luthier on the loose..

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Dave Martin

Those name changes were what I remembered reading about; thank you for the clarification. Like you, I don't understand how a bass could grow a new label, though as a point of reference, my early 60's Juzek (the date is a best guess from the old Bass Viol Shop in Cincinnati) has a label that appears to be a Xerox (or whatever they had before 'real' copiers). Perhaps the distributor in New York was out of paper labels the day mine came through...

The Labels were probably on a sheet that they cut out one by one. I don't recall a single Juzek with a date inside them. I have seen a few older pre-War Anton Wilfer instruments that were imported by Juzek that were dated by Wilfer but never a date from Juzek. Juzek IS the importer, not the maker. One Wenzle Wilfer bass I bought from them was dateless as well. I wrote in a date in blue ink to make the year I first saw that bass in the shop. It could have been older BUT, 100 years from now someone will thank me for at least some reference of time. In my case, I made sure the inked date looked different from the printed label so they know it was done afterwards and not by the maker.

I would have to call Juzek and see if they remember writing dates on the labels. Often, they would just warehouse the instruments and put in a label when they set it up before shipping. I have also seen generic type German basses with Juzek labels that look nothing like a Juzek as well as basses attributed to Juzek or the Juzek shop. GUYS, there never was a Juzek Shop making Basses and Juzek himself (John/Jan) never made a bass in his life according to his Nephew Bobby. They were all contracted.

So, on that note, if I haven't seen your bass, now would be a good time to look at the instrument (back too mainly) as well as the label and see if it's all Kosher, or Juzek..

[Dave Martin]

I understand that there never was a Juzek shop; when I bought it in the mid/late 1980's, the guys at the Bass Viol Shop offered a manufacturing date of probably the 1960's as an admittedly rough guess. I doesn't matter to me, though; the bass functions as intended.

The label doesn't look printed; it looks like it a copy (made in the days before plain paper copiers). The folks at Williams Violins pointed out the label and said it didn't look typical to them the first time I took it to their shop. I'll look at it tomorrow and see if I can get a picture.

[Eric Rene Roy]

Originally Posted by Dave Martin

The label doesn't look printed; it looks like it a copy (made in the days before plain paper copiers).

My old stand mate from high school brought his bass to me recently to make a few repairs on. Although the bass looked nothing like any "Juzek" I have ever seen...it had a photocopied "Juzek" label in it. I told my friend it was not a typical "Juzek", but a decent German Factory flat-back (and honestly better than most of the Juzek's you see), and the label was most likely a fake dropped in to make the bass more appealing.

[Arnold Schnitzer]

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

The Labels were probably on a sheet that they cut out one by one. I don't recall a single Juzek with a date inside them.

Not to contradict you Maestro, but the "Master Art Copy" Juzeks I've seen have a year written on the label. They look to have been penned by hand.

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Arnold Schnitzer

Not to contradict you Maestro, but the "Master Art Copy" Juzeks I've seen have a year written on the label. They look to have been penned by hand.

I don't disagree. I just never seen one. My Bass was a Master Art model but had the WBW label from Wilfer. Juzek Didn't put their label in that bass. I myself 'penned' in the date. There were other basses up there sitting for years unsold and unseen by the public. It would have been a 'hunt' to find out when they were made or when they came in.

I think the Master Art Basses for the most part could have been made before the War and left in stock as the one I got there was old. Bobby Juzek said they can't get these anymore so I assume that it was from after the war by its looks. I first saw that bass in 1966 or so. That's the date I put in it but bought it in late '71.

Those basses called 'Master Art' were made by Wilfer, Wenzel or the elder Anton. I have owned one of each. I have an old catalog page with the same basses advertised and it's not by Juzek. This shows that Wilfer sold them to more than one company here in the states. Juzek sold most of their basses to the Public School system. I assume now that they couldn't buy all the higher end basses that Wilfer could produce so they found someone else to buy their production as well. The maple figuring on the Master Art basses is about the best that's ever grown on the planet.

[Eric Hochberg]

Here's the MasterArt Label from my bass. Has the hand written date that Arnold describes. My bass does not look like the Juzeks I've seen...

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Eric Hochberg

Here's the MasterArt Label from my bass. Has the hand written date that Arnold describes. My bass does not look like the Juzeks I've seen...

Ok, I can't evaluate the paper from here and I don't recall seeing the bass if I have but in 1956, the Wilfer family, suppliers of the Juzek basses had already moved from Shonbach, Czech. near the German border to Bubenreuth in north Bavaria, Germany. This was done at the end of the War in the mid-late 1940s to avoid communist rule.

The date alone is a red flag. Anyone can get a hold of some old labels unused but the dates must mast the location.

Hey, show us the bass!

[Eric Rene Roy]

interesting what that label shows though Eric...there was a label that was removed and the Juzek label is over it slightly...wonder what that label read?

[Eric Hochberg]

You think the rough area above the label was left over from another label? Never thought of that...

There are a few pics of the bass (post #11) and some discussion here:

http://www.smithbassforums.com/showthread.php?t=487

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Eric Hochberg

You think the rough area above the label was left over from another label? Never thought of that...

There are a few pics of the bass here:

http://www.smithbassforums.com/showthread.php?t=487

(post #11)

Post #1, is a Violin shaped bass by Wenzel Wilfer, Germany. That is my guess. Your bass may or may not be Wilfer but a similar style in a Gamba. The Master Art basses however were highly figured Violin cornered basses, not Gambas.

So, '1956 Czech' is the first smoking gun and then the Gamba shape labeled as 'Master Art' is another. I have a 1965 page from Vitale Imports showing a Master Art bass. The flame is a grade or two above the bass in post 1 of your link. Juzek was an importer. So was Vitale who sold to shops. Maybe his business competed with Juzek as well. It is obvious to me from the advertisement that they bought from the same source.

Your Bass looks nice but nothing like any Wilfer/Juzek I have seen. There were other shops making nice basses over there as well. If Juzek was in the business of buying mainly 3/4 plain-Jane gamba basses for the NYC Schools then maybe they were the lower end carved basses produced in Germany then.

I think the aim of Juzek was student grade instruments. I first heard of them in Jr High school from my teacher in Miami Beach, 1965. He was from Miami and a retired pro bassist. He showed me the old Juzek catalog at 50% off list prices and told me what to buy there when I went to NY for the remainder of the Summer. I ended up moving back to NY and stayed there. The Juzek basses and Violins, etc. were promoted to the Schools.

Having a Bass that is NOT a Juzek is no indication of having something less. In many cases or possibly most cases, you have something better than what they offered unless it was an upper line model made by Wilfer, Juzek or other brand name.

On the Flatback Juzek subject I have read that they did import some lower end basses in Flatback but that must have been before the War. I think the troubles that Flatbacks produce may have ended that model with Juzek fairly quickly if it ever even happened. Labels have a way of finding their way into basses where they don't belong! The catalog I saw in '65 had only roundbacks.