Upton Basses

[Richard Prowse]

Originally Posted by Shane Wilcox

Thanks for your thoughts and advice, Richard. I would dearly love Ken and/or Arnold to chime in here -- I understand that there is some "bad blood" relating to various interwebz exchanges between Ken and some people connected with Upton; I am not suggesting that this would colour (spelling again!) Ken's expert opinion regarding the quality of these basses, and his views expressed earlier in this thread seem to predate the "in-house" construction at Upton. This is the main reason for re-opening the question.

I can only reassure you that Ken is a man of honour (sorry again about the spelling Ken) who has the intelligence and integrity to rise well above the infantile level of throwing sand at an opponent.
To quote the musical 'Chess' (imagine Ken saying this),
"I'm a chess player, you play these other games."
Yes, you need to hear from Ken and Arnold now. I step back, like a competent MC would do.

[Ken Smith]

First off, thanks for all the oozing of respect. I do try hard to give out only the facts that I believe in. In fact, I was at Arnold's just yesterday. I dropped off my Hart to make room in my Racks for some other Basses coming in and left it there for him to show to some buyers when they visit. I brought home my Tarr bass with a new c-extension and my newly acquired Claudot bass.

I have read this thread but didn't want to respond in a negative manner off the cuff just because the word 'Upton' was mentioned. I saw their ISB entry in 2009 and played it. I was shocked when 'they' won an award for it as the basses I liked were far better. One of the judges is also a customer of theirs and they just started placing big advertisements in the ISB magazine so you can go figure what happened there. Not bad basses at all, just not award winners as compared to the other seasoned makers that were displayed there. As I told Upton before in writng on line, "I wish them the best of luck in manufacturing basses in USA to compete with European and Asian imports". How they will compete with their prices and stay in business working in USA is a mystery to me. I have been in business here in USA for over 30 years and with the expenses we incur I can't see doing anything but upper end stuff. We just can't compete with low wages and benefits with what some other countries can get away with and cost of living comparisons.

On another note as I did email back to Shane last night about me shipping him a single bass. Freight is usually cheaper with bigger shipments rather than singe pieces and that's IF it gets there in one piece. If you walk IN to my shop and pick up a bass, that's a different story.

On that note, buying a Chinese bass from a well known brand locally, trying it out, inspecting it before you buy and having a dealer there to service you considering this is like a 'big delicate baby' is the way to go. The bigger they are, the harder they fall. Big wood moves more than small wood so seeing a bass 'ready to go' rather than what's behind door #1 is much less risk in making a purchase of a bass. Even if it means you do not buy from me! .. That's just the truth in the matter and no way around it. For beginner basses, Christopher instruments are fairly well respected along with Eastman (here) and Shen. The Stentor I think is a UK brand name Asian Import and don't know what grade of instrument it is so I can't comment. I have played in a section with a high end Christopher 5-string Busetto model and it was beautiful with sound to match. It was on the same level as any high end Shen looking from the outside.

So, I would go for the Christopher by name and have it fully set-up by the dealer/Shop in your area. A no brainer if the price is fair in your parts. You can email shops in the states also for the same model bass set-up and then shipped and then compare as well. The shop you are in had it shipped to them most likely from China. From USA, it would be getting shipped the 2nd time. These come in first as Ocean freight in a container. Buying one bass, you get airfreight, a whole different cost structure. I hope this helps, good luck.

One last note is that if Upton had a dealer there (and they do sell to dealers), then you could compare before you buy and not take the risk yourself on a single shipped bass that you had paid for in advance, blind, with your fingers crossed hoping it gets there the way you expected and in one piece after shipping. Email Upton and see if they have a dealer there. If not, I suggest you buy what you and your teacher (you don't have a teacher yet??) can try and evaluate together.

[Shane Wilcox]

Thanks for the sage advice, Ken. To address your last concern first -- I do have a teacher, and I'm going to try and get him along to try the Stentor with me. And while not ideal in terms of a trial, I am taking what I've heard and felt of Richard's Christopher as an indication of what I might expect from the 401.

I've emailed Upton twice regarding their shipping costs and have yet to receive a reply; I'm not jumping to conclusions, but this does seem rather at odds with their much vaunted reputation for customer service, and would make me a little wary of dealing with them further from such a distance.

I appreciated your fast response to my ill-placed PM (sorry about that) and your candour there and here regarding the costs and risks associated with shipping. Would that I could visit your establishment, but even then, those caveats would apply.

It may be that the Christophers are freighted here from China and set up in Auckland, but I know that the Stentors are sent from China to England for "finishing" and then here for their setup by a good local luthier. Prices here are correspondingly higher than I've seen advertised in the USA and UK, but there are advantages to living at the bottom of the world, too (right, Richard? ).

Thanks again, and I'll shift any further discussion of these basses to the "Chinese/Asian basses" forum.

Shane

Edit: 11 days later and still no response; too late now, I've bought a Christopher.

[Richard Prowse]

Where's the Stentor? In Alistair's shop? Can I come to the trial too? I've played a few Stentors.
Ken: Malcolm, our longest serving and most respected luthier (greater Wellingrton area), talked to me personally of a Stentor that he was really impressed with (I was on his premises getting some work done on my Christopher at the time) - it belongs to the deputy principal of the NZSO (she'd bought it as a 'road bass') and he'd set it up.
Alistair (a guy who runs a local string shop in Wellington and who has been in the business for about 30 years) has imported quite a few Stentors over the last few years. He often asks me to test basses he gets in, so I've played a few Stentors.
In my opinion Christophers and Stentors are pretty comparable and it would depend on the individual bass as to which is 'better'.
Alistair did tell me that he felt the last few Chinese basses he'd brought in (I didn't see these ones and I don't know if they were Stentors or not) weren't really up to scratch and he thought they were trying to cut costs, now that their reputation had been cemented - evidently one had a plastic nut!

[Shane Wilcox]

Hey Richard -- I'm emailing you!

[Richard Prowse]

And I'm waiting for it.

[Richard Prowse]

Got it!

I'll bring my bow.