The Lurker Speaks....

[Bob Branstetter]

Originally Posted by stan haskins

Then there are idiots like me who keep posting in both places!

I also still post occasionally on TB, but like many others I lost the desire to be an active participant after the purge or what ever you want to call it. Although this site does not have the participation numbers of TB, I personally find that there seems to be a lot more adults (mentally) over here.

[Steve_M]

What purge was that, Bob?

[Bob Branstetter]

I doubt if anyone here wants to rehash that business over again. If you are interested, you can go to the TB forums and search Miscellaneous [DB] for "Ken Smith". There are still some threads left there from around January 2007 that will give you an idea of what happened.

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Bob Branstetter

I doubt if anyone here wants to rehash that business over again. If you are interested, you can go to the TB forums and search Miscellaneous [DB] for "Ken Smith". There are still some threads left there from around January 2007 that will give you an idea of what happened.

The actual Thread that all this happened in was deleted by me. There are Threads before and after but the main one I deleted which was actually created to smooth things out but I got caught in the crossfire.

The whole thing in my view was Money motivated as their main advertiser was over protected to the degree that the Mods would close, edit and delete posts if they shined any light in a direction which they felt were taboo. Those include the advertiser that owned most of the banner space and the Mods themselves regardless of what they say or who they personally attack or insult.

When I first joined TB it was to defend claims against my product, company and myself. I did that fairly well and in a short time including rallying many supporters. One of the flame throwers then was a Mod and today he still is a Mod. In this latest instance a member started making insulting comments about me which were off topic and off color as well. I asked that same Mod of a few years past to delete his off topic insulting comments or I will leave TB and delete my threads. He thought it was OK to air things out in MY thread which he them deemed an Airing Thread which it wasn't but served his justifications well. I had no business at all with this guy but he felt he needed to take aim like a sniper from behind TBs womb.

What we all didn't know then was that the guy attacking me on-line was just about to become a MOD in a day or so which was decided behind the scenes. Paul of TB warned me after that I was NOT allowed to say things about the Mods because they are Immune from actions. What that person did was days before he became a Mod and nothing to do at all with being a Mod or even the thread topic itself!

Keeping my word and my back against the wall I proceeded to delete THAT Thread which had personal insults and then spent the rest of the evening and most of the next day deleting my Posts and Threads. What I left was the ones about the Historical Basses which had a lot of input from others as well as older ones that couldn't be deleted anymore. I deleted about 600 threads out of almost 3,800 I had posted.

A few days later the Mod started his own thread about 'don't look at me' kind of thing saying he didn't delete the thread but rather I did. This thread grew a bit in a few days but the Mod never said what led me to do what I did. I mentioned how I was attacked out of color there and the Mod would not 'moderate' it as he should like he has in the past in a controlling 'thought police' manner for a certain advertiser which there is another thread as well about this.

I then made a comment directed at Paul (TB owner) 'what a Fxxxxing dog and pony show' you have here meaning that for a big advertiser he can plant shills and have all the negative comments and those of discovery deleted or edited but for the rest of us, we must take the 'censored/controlled' Forum or leave it!

I didn't spell out that word above in my Post with the xxxx's. Actually, Paul deleted it 2x and I dared him in the first attempt to leave my comment for all to see and understand what actually did happen. After all the questions of what happened, he reposts my 'fight back' post as if that was the actual reason why I am off of TB. NO, it was my reaction to what actually happened and not what did happen. After that, I was not able to Post or PM or even edit my own Profile because I was Blocked or Banned. I could Log in, read and search but could not reply or participate in anyway. Paul went on to add that I was NOT Banned and was gone on my own accord which was an outright lie. Then he added later that I could come back if I agreed to abide by his Rules which in my mind, I never broke. It was his 'Mod to be' that broke the rules by attacking me on-line but he couldn't admit that or take action because another Mod just quit in the midst of this 'thought police' accusations which was started by Jeff Bollbach and was justified in doing so and he needed him to replace the other Mod.

TBs money policies and Mod actions have a big part in this as well as the Mods actually being participants. Sort of a conflict of interest in my eye but hey, it's a public Forum. Now I'm gone an started my own, much smaller and non-commercial party as far as monies go. I have talked with Paul since and he says the same thing about an agreement. I told him to let me on as-is because I never broke the agreement before. This is his actual living now and his Orchestra job a second as far as I can tell.

I don't at all mind talking about this and TB so if you have questions, then we can have them here. I don't want to start a new thread 'why ken left TB' and make it a bashing party.

I see very few of the older type more serious DB/Bow type questions we used to see there. We do get some here and they get some there but for the most part, there is just less of it all around. To help this along, if you see a thread on TB about DBs that needs professional help, feel free to PM the thread starter and give him the link over here. Just be sure to remind him to use his real/full name so we don't have to chase him down for it..lol

Thx guys and gals for hanging out here. It has been working out real good in my eyes regardless of the much smaller crowd we have.

[Steve_M]

Well Ken, you have my vote of sympathy. I've got issues with their mods too, but based on their apathy rather than a hidden agenda. Good on ya for airing the issue anyway.

Bob - thanks for clarifying, I have threads saved already.

I find Paul at Talkbass inconsistent which is unfortunate in my view.

I've been bullied on Talkbass because I own and run a competitive forum at www.basschat.co.uk and the tribal nature that sometimes exists on Talkbass singled me out after someone on Bassworld took issue with me over acting in respect of their behaviour. Basschat used to be www.bassworld.co.uk but there's a whole story behind that which I won't go into in this thread. Check out my other post on this forum here if you're interested.

Paul sent me an pm recently regarding how a test-site we'd registered for bassworld called "basstalk.co.uk" was "smearing" its interests with talkbass. We're going to keep the domain for the forseeable future but point it to the Basschat webforum, which seems to be doing amazingly well with over 600 members signing up in 3 weeks since its inception! We've also managed to shake some of the forum parasites too so it all looks good - all the best people have stayed. BTW, if any of you feel like an alternative to TB, give us some consideration. We're smaller but a lot friendlier and every member does actually exist!

I reckon Paul's making a good income from Talkbass and as its sole "employee" he's bound to protect his own interests. Unfortunately Talkbass.com is so big that I think its unlikely a politically influential clique will get an overview (or even care, for that matter). Its difficult for one voice to be remembered.

Ken did the absolute right thing in setting this forum up. As I've already said previously, if he hadn't done it this year, I would have.

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Steve_M

Well Ken, you have my vote of sympathy. I've got issues with their mods too, but based on their apathy rather than a hidden agenda. Good on ya for airing the issue anyway.

Bob - thanks for clarifying, I have threads saved already.

I find Paul at Talkbass inconsistent which is unfortunate in my view.

I reckon Paul's making a good income from Talkbass and as its sole "employee" he's bound to protect his own interests. Unfortunately Talkbass.com is so big that I think its unlikely a politically influential clique will get an overview (or even care, for that matter). Its difficult for one voice to be remembered.

Ken did the absolute right thing in setting this forum up. As I've already said previously, if he hadn't done it this year, I would have.

Well thank's for the vote of sympathy Steve but my intention here and there as well was just a bright light shining on the truth. I did not go on TB for 'hobby' reasons initially but with my interests rekindling in the DB field it did turn in that direction. Then as I decided to 'double up' and start selling Basses and Bows once again and it was back to business but with my hobby being my work. I enjoyed meeting Jeff and Arnold thru TB and still enjoy their company on occasion as well as meeting all the other Luthiers that if not for TB I may have never known they existed.

Only a few are rubbed the wrong way as far as the TB commercial policies go which carry with them the protection of some of the advertisers but if that's what they (Paul and his helpers) want it to be then I will just spend my time and energy elsewhere.

In the BG field I answered a lot of questions and shared my knowledge with many including the development of the Luthiers Forum on TB which quickly grew into a do-it-yourselfer's page but hey, that's what the call progress these days. In the DB world I got reacquainted with my old self on all levels and learned a bit about what I had missed in the last 15-20 years being away from it. In return, I shared my past experiences and knowledge of various Bass making Schools as well as new research and a few musical things along the way. Yes, I was a professional Bassist for 20 years and have plenty of stories to tell but most do not know that about me. TB gave me a chance to come alive again verbally and musically only to see a few resent my presence especially when my postings made a few see where they might be wrong about something and resented it.

So now we have this Forum which requires Real names for which some bravery must be rewarded for posting publicly for the world to see. This month alone we have averaged 731 unique visits per day for the first 28 days of the month of May. Although Posting is low as compared to other Forums, it's the quality of the text and the people writing it that makes it worth spending time on-line. This includes Richard 'The Poet" from Down somewhere..lol

[Richard Prowse]

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

This includes Richard 'The Poet" from Down somewhere..lol

Ah, thanks Ken for the vote of confidence. For me there is only one bass site... right here. Hey, I enjoy reading the serious threads too. Did you ever get to play that cornerless bass as a three string?