Magazines & Advertising

[Ken Smith]

Years and years ago I was reading thru some promo material of one of the magazines. Included in the promo pack was a 'reader survey'. One of the questions was, if they buy instruments that are related to famous names using the? I would have thought this to be a biggie response wise but no, it wasn't. The biggie was that they but what they like after feeling and testing it out themselves.

This was back in the early '80s when I had time to read these 'bull crap' surveys. A persons ego filling out a form wont let him say he need to see a star playing it because his own judgment was superior to that of a rock star he would lick the feet of if given the chance. This was a Guitar Magazine focused mostly on Rock and as you know back in the '80s and even today, if some guy with fast licks, tight pants and a pin cushion face makes the cover of a magazine, those kids at home reading the magazine will jump up yelling "mommy, mommy, I want that!".. lol

Sad, but true!

Now, in my business when the magazines would approach me about that type of player ad or even a top player asking for an endorsement my answer was "Anthony Jackson doesn't care what Stanley Clarke plays!"

As at that time, they were both Smith customers and neither gave a rats behind what tools the other used. My Basses were mainly over 2k then and even though people bought them because they were seen, it wasn't because of 'who' was playing one but more like 'what' was that guy playing!

Around 1983 or so I was in my booth at the Chicago Namm show when a Japanese guy came up to me and said "your Bass is the most Famous in Japan". I was thinking how? I never sold any there. BUT, a few guys who had them like Anthony, Stanley and maybe one or two more had traveled to Japan using them. No names were mentioned about who played my Basses, just that the Bass itself was Famous.

It was around that time if not earlier that I took on the belief that making famous players models was not in my best interest. The Basses we made for Anthony would not at all be something I would market. Also, my BT model made then was a better playing Bass than what Anthony had requested so he could have his own one-of-a-kind Bass. Hey, let the Chef Cook the way he knows how to!

So, going with your gut feelings is sometimes the best voice you have to listen to! 'Go with what you know' as they say...

[Dennis Michaels]

All I know is you build the perfect basses "for me". I play them and don't really care who else does. Thank god many do tho or you may not be here today.

[David Powell]

I think when I was younger it made more difference to me who was playing which guitar through what, but that was greatly connected to the signature sound of the gear as well. Like Ritchie Blackmore just wouldn't have sounded the same on a Gibson, nor would Donald Roeser sound the same on a strat. For instance when I saw Geddy Lee, he used a Rickenbacker for almost all of the set, and switched to a Fender for Working Man only. He was still Geddy Lee, but the sound that stuck in my head was the sound of the Rickenbacker. When he switched to the Fender, he sounded different. It probably wouldn't have mattered who was playing those two basses, I could hear a certain sound there. And I never would have liked Rickenbacker based on a photo of Geddy Lee holding one. I'd have to hear him playing it. Same with the other gear. Hearing it in a live situation in a big hall was how my preferences developed.

If I remember right, the first Smith bass I saw live I didn't know what it was and it wasn't a particularly famous player then, but he might be by now. I made certain that I could remember the headstock, because the sound was really clear and full. The note definition was quite remarkable. Of course the fellow had great technique, but there is a great deal of the live sound that has to do with the instrument. The guy was playing with Maynard Ferguson's band in a pretty large school auditorium and I was pretty far in the back. So it is good to have that distinctive headstock because it really was a kind of "What is he playing" kind of thing. And after I checked out what had that headstock, I could spot a Ken Smith visually as well as by sound. During the eighties, those headstocks began to pop up with great regularity among the better pro players I saw.

I guess I still pay attention to what I see being played, but if I can get hold of one to play, that makes more difference. And I think my tastes in sound have changed, perhaps refined a bit as I listen to different music types. One instrument that really impressed me when I first saw it was the Clevinger. So I have a question that I'll frame Ken. In that you play fine double basses but build electric basses, have you ever considered building an electric bass that could be bowed double bass style? The name "electric upright" has never sat to well with me, I'd prefer "electric double bass" as a name for a vertical electric bass that has arco capability.

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by David Powell

I think when I was younger it made more difference to me who was playing which guitar through what, but that was greatly connected to the signature sound of the gear as well. Like Ritchie Blackmore just wouldn't have sounded the same on a Gibson, nor would Donald Roeser sound the same on a strat. For instance when I saw Geddy Lee, he used a Rickenbacker for almost all of the set, and switched to a Fender for Working Man only. He was still Geddy Lee, but the sound that stuck in my head was the sound of the Rickenbacker. When he switched to the Fender, he sounded different. It probably wouldn't have mattered who was playing those two basses, I could hear a certain sound there. And I never would have liked Rickenbacker based on a photo of Geddy Lee holding one. I'd have to hear him playing it. Same with the other gear. Hearing it in a live situation in a big hall was how my preferences developed.

If I remember right, the first Smith bass I saw live I didn't know what it was and it wasn't a particularly famous player then, but he might be by now. I made certain that I could remember the headstock, because the sound was really clear and full. The note definition was quite remarkable. Of course the fellow had great technique, but there is a great deal of the live sound that has to do with the instrument. The guy was playing with Maynard Ferguson's band in a pretty large school auditorium and I was pretty far in the back. So it is good to have that distinctive headstock because it really was a kind of "What is he playing" kind of thing. And after I checked out what had that headstock, I could spot a Ken Smith visually as well as by sound. During the eighties, those headstocks began to pop up with great regularity among the better pro players I saw.

I guess I still pay attention to what I see being played, but if I can get hold of one to play, that makes more difference. And I think my tastes in sound have changed, perhaps refined a bit as I listen to different music types. One instrument that really impressed me when I first saw it was the Clevinger. So I have a question that I'll frame Ken. In that you play fine double basses but build electric basses, have you ever considered building an electric bass that could be bowed double bass style? The name "electric upright" has never sat to well with me, I'd prefer "electric double bass" as a name for a vertical electric bass that has arco capability.

First, I don't know who the player was with Maynard. At first I though Gordon Johnson but he was with Chuck Mangione.

Second, the Bowable Bass has been made and exhibited in my Booth both at the NY Guitar Show (c.1986?) and NAMM a time or two back then but I was not the maker or brand. We did make some Fingerboards for the maker and sold him some parts as well. The builders name was Danny Augustino and he called it the 'Bass-o-lin'.

[Anselm Hauke]

bass-o-lin?
http://www.otheroom.com/namm98/Inst.htm

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Anselm Hauke

bass-o-lin?
http://www.otheroom.com/namm98/Inst.htm

Thx, you found it;



NAMM, 1998;
And now for the bass players that might have felt left out in the previous item, here's the Bass O Lin.This is an instrument that's happy being played like an electric bass, upright bass and as a bowed bass. There are something like ten different playing positions between strapping it on and using it upright. There are fretted and fretless models available.
Dan Agostino
Lanoka Harbor, New Jersey, USA
(609)971-1643
or (914)942-5123


I have no idea if his contact info it current from 10 years ago, sry. contasy

[Tim Bishop]

Originally Posted by Dennis Michaels

All I know is you build the perfect basses "for me". I play them and don't really care who else does. Thank god many do tho or you may not be here today.

I'm totally with you Dennis and I've always said that: "Ken makes a bass that is perfect for me and there just happens to be an S on the head-stock". Never have given "a rip" less about what magazines and/or endorsements show (unless of course it's Eden's and Smith's ).

A recent experience I'll attempt to keep short.......

I recently (and reluctantly) sold one of my favorite Smiths (a '97 Tiger Maple 5GN) to an acquaintance and bassist. Wonderful individual and player and I was totally wanting to help him out by fixing him up with THE bass. Understand, he was accustomed to a bolt-on neck feel (there's another thread on this topic, so, don't want to get into that debate here), so, a neck-thru would be a new experience for him.

I set the bass up perfectly for him (as we discussed set-up beforehand) before I shipped. At any rate, when he received the bass and played it, he later decided it was not the bass for him........come again....say what! This was the first time I EVER ran across anyone that wasn't pleased with a Smith. His decision was totally based on feel as I clearly understood and prepared him for that beforehand. So, I asked him "did you change anything"? To my dismay, he responded, "yes, I changed the strings from Taper Core Mediums to Lights" (which changed the set-up as we had initially discussed) .... .... errghhhhh!!! .... I said to myself: Take a deeeeeep breath in, now breeeeathhhh out......repeat.....ok.....

Yeah, I know, another lesson learned. Just goes to prove, you cannot please everyone (particularly those that don't understand the importance of set-ups). Had I anticipated this, I would have NEVER sold that bass. I'm hoping, as I've discussed with him, he will give it more time to work out the "feel thing", otherwise, I will be working toward getting that bass back ASAP!

[David Powell]

Originally Posted by Tim Bishop

I'm totally with you Dennis and I've always said that: "Ken makes a bass that is perfect for me and there just happens to be an S on the head-stock". Never have given "a rip" less about what magazines and/or endorsements show (unless of course it's Eden's and Smith's ).

A recent experience I'll attempt to keep short.......

I recently (and reluctantly) sold one of my favorite Smiths (a '97 Tiger Maple 5GN) to an acquaintance and bassist. Wonderful individual and player and I was totally wanting to help him out by fixing him up with THE bass. Understand, he was accustomed to a bolt-on neck feel (there's another thread on this topic, so, don't want to get into that debate here), so, a neck-thru would be a new experience for him.

I set the bass up perfectly for him (as we discussed set-up beforehand) before I shipped. At any rate, when he received the bass and played it, he later decided it was not the bass for him........come again....say what! This was the first time I EVER ran across anyone that wasn't pleased with a Smith. His decision was totally based on feel as I clearly understood and prepared him for that beforehand. So, I asked him "did you change anything"? To my dismay, he responded, "yes, I changed the strings from Taper Core Mediums to Lights" (which changed the set-up as we had initially discussed) .... .... errghhhhh!!! .... I said to myself: Take a deeeeeep breath in, now breeeeathhhh out......repeat.....ok.....

Yeah, I know, another lesson learned. Just goes to prove, you cannot please everyone (particularly those that don't understand the importance of set-ups). Had I anticipated this, I would have NEVER sold that bass. I'm hoping, as I've discussed with him, he will give it more time to work out the "feel thing", otherwise, I will be working toward getting that bass back ASAP!

Well, this is going off topic, but I can certainly feel you here. It falls under that "no good deed goes unpunished" category. Years ago, out of necessity I learned very well the painful process of properly setting up a tremolo strat. It's a MF cause everything you change changes everything else. But there is a systematic way to do it, it just takes time, and lots of it. So I get this neophyte fellow a great deal on a pawn shop strat, go to great pains to get genuine replacement hardware for a few things that were missing, bought some brand new strings and got the thing as near perfect as any set-up I've ever done. First time he changes the strings he changes the gauge to heavy because some idiot kid at GC tells him thus and so. And then he has to file the nut because the heavier gauge is sticking and he's wondering why his "action" is all high now, he can't get it in tune, and comes asking me what is wrong with this guitar I "sold" him;- "All I did was change the strings....", he says. !@#$$%!!!!!

Note, I never sold him anything. I helped him pick it out. And he blames me because I lined him up with it. OK, that's as much as I can bear to re-live. So I leave neophytes that don't take my advice alone now, and I never do anything to a guitar unless someone pays me. Otherwise they think you must be getting some advantage somewhere. They only respect your work if you charge them. So someone wants me to set up a tremolo strat- $100 minimum. The normal response is, "I can buy a guitar for that.." And I'm like "Fine, but can you play it that way..."

One of the things that impressed me the most about the KSB's that I have played was that the set-up was perfect everywhere. And the fret work is the best I've ever seen. There are many other things as well, but those stick out so far above the other makers that these are worth remark. Truly here in Atlanta, we have a treasure in the Atlanta Bass Gallery. But he never has enough fretless basses. I was in there a couple of days ago and he must have had 6 or 7 Smiths and not a single fret-less. I guess if he gets one, it goes pretty fast. But here, that place is great because you can really play and hear all the "best" makers' work. Of the top hand-made basses I think he sells more Smiths than anything else. I would say having Smith basses in these types of bass specialty shops is a great way to get the news across. There are some makers who you must deal with directly, and to me that is just too risky for an instrument that is truly an investment. Even if I were ordering an instrument custom to my specs, the fact that I have seen several in a store and been able to play them against other makers work is very important. Otherwise you don't have much to go on but looks and endorsements in magazines. With KSB, I think I would have no worries about a commissioned instrument;- but that is because of the long history of consistent quality. That reputation has been earned over many years.

[Ken Smith]

Magazines & Advertising??

Anyone? Thx guys..

[David Powell]

This is totally off topic, but related. The bass-o-lin is not really what I was hoping for. Clevinger is one of those companies that will only deal directly with customers and there are no dealers. That bothers me, but I would like to have a Clevinger type instrument. The other thing that bothers me about them is that they are totally unwilling to customize anything.

It just occurs to me that if Ken Smith made an instrument similar in design to the Clevinger, it would be beyond compare to anything like that currently available. I know it might be like invading new territory, but the bass-o-lin is too much bass guitar and not enough double bass. I guess I could talk to that fellow, but it seems like too much of a hybrid animal and what I'm hoping for is an improvement on the EUB, although I don't like that moniker, I think the concept is a good one;- to have an instrument that is feed back free, that has a rich arco tone when amplified and identical dimensions to a DB.

Of the EUBs currently available, Ken, have you tried any of them or have a favorite or just an impression of how you view those that you are willing to share?

[Dennis Michaels]

Originally Posted by David Powell

This is totally off topic, but related. The bass-o-lin is not really what I was hoping for. Clevinger is one of those companies that will only deal directly with customers and there are no dealers. That bothers me, but I would like to have a Clevinger type instrument. The other thing that bothers me about them is that they are totally unwilling to customize anything.

It just occurs to me that if Ken Smith made an instrument similar in design to the Clevinger, it would be beyond compare to anything like that currently available. I know it might be like invading new territory, but the bass-o-lin is too much bass guitar and not enough double bass. I guess I could talk to that fellow, but it seems like too much of a hybrid animal and what I'm hoping for is an improvement on the EUB, although I don't like that moniker, I think the concept is a good one;- to have an instrument that is feed back free, that has a rich arco tone when amplified and identical dimensions to a DB.

Of the EUBs currently available, Ken, have you tried any of them or have a favorite or just an impression of how you view those that you are willing to share?

I agree, I'd buy one. For now it is my Zeta "Crossover " 4 string (what a little neck) but it sounds pretty good at least.

[Dennis Michaels]

I have said before "wouldn't it be boring if everybody played the same gear?" If there was 1 perfect bass and amp for the world it would be less then eventful. I believe KSB are the best instrument built in any price range and I thank Ken for keeping them affordable in comparrison to some others. Tho not inexpensive by any means we are also not gouged either.

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by David Powell

This is totally off topic, but related. The bass-o-lin is not really what I was hoping for. Clevinger is one of those companies that will only deal directly with customers and there are no dealers. That bothers me, but I would like to have a Clevinger type instrument. The other thing that bothers me about them is that they are totally unwilling to customize anything.

It just occurs to me that if Ken Smith made an instrument similar in design to the Clevinger, it would be beyond compare to anything like that currently available. I know it might be like invading new territory, but the bass-o-lin is too much bass guitar and not enough double bass. I guess I could talk to that fellow, but it seems like too much of a hybrid animal and what I'm hoping for is an improvement on the EUB, although I don't like that moniker, I think the concept is a good one;- to have an instrument that is feed back free, that has a rich arco tone when amplified and identical dimensions to a DB.

Of the EUBs currently available, Ken, have you tried any of them or have a favorite or just an impression of how you view those that you are willing to share?

I have played a few and even owned a BabyBass back in the late from '68-'72 or so. Been there, done that..

You should hear my 5er with the Shadow PU and the SWR.. Wow.. My Loveri smokes, the Martini rumbles, the Gilkes scares, the Bisiach puts you back in the 60s and the Batchelder makes you cry all with the shadow pickup. Even my Shens sound and play great with an Amp and I have sold several Basses including the Italian Solo Bass, The Dodd and the Prescott that turned heads plugged in or not..

Why on earth would I even have a bad dream about playing on a 2x4 with strings on it? I like it real, gut shaking Bass notes with some old wood scarring the neighbors.. lol

Hitchcock's new thriller "Mommy, Mommy, The Bass is Playing"..

A Bass is a Bass and a Guitar is a Guitar. Toys are for children!

[David Powell]

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

I have played a few and even owned a BabyBass back in the late from '68-'72 or so. Been there, done that..

You should hear my 5er with the Shadow PU and the SWR.. Wow.. My Loveri smokes, the Martini rumbles, the Gilkes scares, the Bisiach puts you back in the 60s and the Batchelder makes you cry all with the shadow pickup. Even my Shens sound and play great with an Amp and I have sold several Basses including the Italian Solo Bass, The Dodd and the Prescott that turned heads plugged in or not..

Why on earth would I even have a bad dream about playing on a 2x4 with strings on it? I like it real, gut shaking Bass notes with some old wood scarring the neighbors.. lol

Hitchcock's new thriller "Mommy, Mommy, The Bass is Playing"..

A Bass is a Bass and a Guitar is a Guitar. Toys are for children!

I can see your point all the way there, Ken, and for you, that approach probably does ruin what is the integral quality of a DB. But what happens when you want that big arco sound and have to travel by air and play some place with a mic'd up drummer? Do you bite the bullet and get a hard shell case and put it on a plane? I'm serious. The EUB is the last thing on my list, but it is on there because of gigs I played where the previous bassist with a pogo stick had a huge advantage over me because I could not control the feedback at the level needed to be heard. Is that when you just smile and break out a Black Tiger and go fusion??? I guess I could deal with that ....