History of the American Bass

[Ken Smith]

[quote=Martin Sheridan;16703]

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

The Banjo guy? No, never met him. All I have to offer at the moment is the Batchelder Bass but enjoy talking about it.

Ken,
David Bromberg is probably the foremost authority on American Violin makers and probably possesses the largest collection. Back in the 60s he was on many popular albums as a back up player; guitar and sometimes fiddle. He later attended and graduated from the Chicago School of Violin Making. He used to come into my shop fairly often when I was in downtown Chicago. He was traveling all over the world then buying and selling instruments and bows. Last I heard he had opened a violin shop in the east.
Great Thread!

But, does this guy have 'anything' at all to do with Basses? I have never heard his name mentioned associated with a single bass, ever.

Most of the American makers that made basses made basses. A few made mainly Violins and some basses. The Wenberg book has about the most published on American makers than all the English and European books combined. Stil, I find some makers missing like the actual Batchelder that made my old bass.

As with any book, if they made mainly basses, they might be left out of books when written as the names are not known about to them.

Boston's mid 19th century Asa and Jay White made both as did the elder August and George Gemunder did in Springfield Mass. before moving to New York.

[Martin Sheridan]

Not as far as I know. He was interested in my basses in a general way, but he's really a violin collector.

Thanks for bringing so much information together on the American makers, there's a real hole in the knowledge about bass makers generally.

The VSA Journal had an article on some Germans who made basses in Pennsylvania some years back. The black bass above attributed to Prescott looks very similar to their work.

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Martin Sheridan

Not as far as I know. He was interested in my basses in a general way, but he's really a violin collector.

Thanks for bringing so much information together on the American makers, there's a real hole in the knowledge about bass makers generally.

The VSA Journal had an article on some Germans who made basses in Pennsylvania some years back. The black bass above attributed to Prescott looks very similar to their work.

Well, it is believed that the Prescott design is generally German taken from I believe a Hornsteiner or something similar. There were many Germans and English settlers in New England that made Violin family instruments. Mostly Violins and Basses. I have heard of and seen very few if any Violas or Cellos from this period. Cellos in the way of Church Basses yes but standard measured Violincellos we see hardly any from the 19th century Yankee makers. The Violins are all basically European in design. The Basses however have their own Yankee flair. I must exclude the first generation Gemunder brothers that came over made what they knew from France and maybe Germany. George Gemunder of the 2 Basses I have seen are totally French in design and Varnish as he came over here straight from Vuillaume's shop. His older Brother August however of the 2 Basses I know of his (one of which I own) are closer to a Gagliano if anything. Long body with flatback but shorter FFs that you would see on a Neapolitan bass. I am guessing he may have seen one as an example but made smaller FFs for tone and design preference. This Bass looks so Italian I could re-label it and no one would question the provenance.

It is also believer than Prescott used an only English Viol for his long Scroll/pegbox design. His basses were all originally 3-string from what I have seen and the heads can easily take 5 or even 6 tuners in them.

I guess this is what you get generally when makers partly copy and partly think on their own. The first time I saw the G. Gemunder bass I asked if it was an old Bernardel! The first time I saw the G.Gemunder I thought it was Gagliano school bass. The later made NY Gemunder Basses look mainly German to me, imported from there and finished up over here. Without the Label they are German shop basses for the most part. If they were made here then there was no originality at all in the design as they are perfect models of the German basses from the end of the 19th to the early 20th century.

Well anyway, the more you see, the more you know. Thus is the case as long as what you compare them to are correctly known models/makers as well.

[Arnold Schnitzer]

I have read that Klotz' designs were the basis for Prescott, not Hornsteiner's.

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Arnold Schnitzer

I have read that Klotz' designs were the basis for Prescott, not Hornsteiner's.

Yes, I have read that too but the last time I saw a Klotz bass it was actually an old Hornsteiner to my eye. And, which Klotz? Klotz was a famous family and the founding family of the Mittenwald school. Why not name all old Mittenwald basses Klotz? I don't know which are real Klotz's, Neuners or Hornsteiners. They all look alike to me.

Hey, I would love to see a REAL Confirmed Mathius Klotz Double Bass. The last tine I saw something that looked like a M. Klotz, it had a famous Italian name.

[Arnold Schnitzer]

I'm pretty sure Prescott pre-dated the Hornsteiner shop.

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Arnold Schnitzer

I'm pretty sure Prescott pre-dated the Hornsteiner shop.

Not really so Maestro. The Hornsteiners date from the early 18th century and the commercial firm of Neuner & Hornsteiner dates from 1750, about 70 years before any recorded Prescott bass. Perhaps here in USA we have only seen the later made basses as the old ones are stuck in the Central European Orchestras and not going anywhere. The Neuner family dates from even a century earlier, the 17th.

Remember that Thread I started called Where are They??

I started that Thread because I knew there were old Mittenwald basses by these families but rarely seen here in USA or on the internet anywhere. They were made but probably scarce in comparision and just not available for sale that we ever see.

Just because a bass is very old, large and has lower rounded corners does not make it a Klotz unless it was made by one of that family.