"Flexocor strings info from Ken Smith" (from TB, 2005)

[Thomas Erickson]

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

Ok, as promised I am posting some results and an addition.

On the Martini with the Orig flex and Perm E/C, the sound was nice unless you had been using reg Flex Starks. I could hear the edge on each the note when a great player from the NYC Ballet was trying the Martini up at Arnolds as well as when Arnold or myself played it. It did not at all sound bad. It just didn't sound as good as it would after changing strings. The Martini has good mids in the tone and needs the darker Stark reg Flexs for my ear. I soon put the reg Flex Starks on all 4 strings and the sound was darker, smoother and more even than I had ever heard the Bass. I think Arnolds Ext and some tweaking was partly to blame! I prefer this set to all other Pirastro strings now personally.

A few months ago I sent a very old set of Flexocors to Pirastro to test. They looked like the reg Flex but the gauges on all but the G were much heavier than even the Starks. Last week, Pirastro sent me a letter saying 'These are pre-1991 strings and are similar to our new Orig Flex" and sent me a set as a thank you for me efforts. I now went and measured the Orig Flexs and noticed the gauges were similar but the sound is not. I still think the reg Flex is the closest sound to the Old Flexs pre 1991. I just hope the keep offering the Stark gauges as they seem to be the best I have found.

Ken - do you know if there's a way to tell the pre-1991 flexos from the current "original flexo"? I have a very old D and G that I love, but I'm not sure if they're just really well used (former teacher took them off his orchestra bass, gave 'em to a broke student (me) who played 'em for years) or a different string altogether because they seem better than the current "originals". They measure about <.06 for the G and >.07 for the D. Digital caliper isn't very accurate.

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Thomas Erickson

Ken - do you know if there's a way to tell the pre-1991 flexos from the current "original flexo"? I have a very old D and G that I love, but I'm not sure if they're just really well used (former teacher took them off his orchestra bass, gave 'em to a broke student (me) who played 'em for years) or a different string altogether because they seem better than the current "originals". They measure about <.06 for the G and >.07 for the D. Digital caliper isn't very accurate.

Measure in inches please. .049" is what it would be close to.

For older strings, look for a fine wire wrapped around the colored threads in the peg pox area. Those are the old ones. The Flexocor that I remember are the ruby color threads, not the dark blue. However, I have found both types with the wire threads up a the top.

[Thomas Erickson]

Ok I remeasured a few more times; averaged out the G is .053 and the D .063. Final answer. These have the dark blue-purple silk on bottom, while up top they are the same but with the twist of silver wire. The last half of the D is red silk with the silver.

Pirastro really should post online a comprehensive chart showing all the different incarnations of their strings over the years - seems like nobody can keep this stuff straight. I'm probably the worst.

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Thomas Erickson

Ok I remeasured a few more times; averaged out the G is .053 and the D .063. Final answer. These have the dark blue-purple silk on bottom, while up top they are the same but with the twist of silver wire. The last half of the D is red silk with the silver.

Pirastro really should post online a comprehensive chart showing all the different incarnations of their strings over the years - seems like nobody can keep this stuff straight. I'm probably the worst.

I have spoken with them and with someone here. Two conflicting stories. The NY guy tells me they were made here in USA and excess shipped back to Germany. The USA supplied strings made in USA. Pirastro denies that but my source knew the guy and company.

I have sent strings back to Pirastro in the past and they flat out deny what I have been told. They are very secretive about how things are made. For awhile, some believed that the current orig flex blue and the Original flatchrome white/blue were the exact same string. Pirastro sent me one of each and they are totally different in every way.

If they always made them in Germany, then why did they have to make the flex 92s and the orig flex all over again? They loose the recipe? Or, when the USA guy retired and closed up shop, he kept his info and just walked away?

So, regardless of what was, we have to deal in present time what is..

[Emanuele Carbone]

Hello,

I have a new "Stanzani" Italian double bass (105 cm, 3/4ish, flat-back) which is still "fresh" and quite on the bright side, tone-wise.

I bought it some months ago with a set of Flexocor (92's, the ruby wire ones) which I truly believe are "regular", quite a tested standard for bowing.

Well, compared to other basses around (which I have to say are old, or at least older and broken in - none of them has Flex mounted) my bass tends to have a fairly pronounced midrangy and ringing sound, full of those harmonics which remind me of a brass instrument, if you know what I mean. They project very well on upper solo registers, but the bass's sound is fairly thinner than those I have compared it with and tends to get scratchy, hollow and nasal during fast orchestra passages, at least from my point of listening, the player's one. Therefore, I find these strings a bit unforgiving: every minor bowing flaw seems to get through.

Now I'm starting to fancy a fairly punchier and bassier sound, with some more fundamental presence on this bass. Just to make a comparison with electric basses, which I hope won't sound stupid, it's as if I had a Fender Jazz and were looking for a timbre which is a bit more "MusicMan-ish"... and I love Fender Jazz basses, by the way!
The comparison could also be appropriate when talking about orchestra/small ensembe situations: there are times when it cuts through well, mostly during melodic passages, but overally I feel like the tone's a bit hollow within the "group".

What I'd like to know is:

- is that feeling quite common with these strings on new bright basses? Otherwise, are they a good way to judge whether a bass is a good-sounding one or not? I obviously hope that the earlier case is truer... I have to say that I tried to put a low E from a set of solo Flat-Chromesteel (white/blue wire) and it seems to sound creamier and fuller than the Flex E... even if it was meant to be tuned one tone higher! Unfortunately, the 3rd Flat-Cr. string tuned to A doesn't really work well instead.

- What would you suggest me as next replacement? I was thinking of Evah, or Obligato... would you throw in another option? I would avoid Belcanto because I'm afraid I'd still end up having a fairly nasal tone.

- According to my experience on this bass, I'd say that the Flexocor are a bit more suited for solo melodic playing rather than earthy orchestra passages. Is it true even if they are the choice for many orchestral players? Are they a good orchestral choice just for old or very dark basses?

Thank you in advance, thanks to Ken as well for this useful forum and to all its contributors!

[Ken Smith]

On your question for a more compatible string than the Flexocor lets look at a few points mentioned.

>>> Your bass is a fairly new modern bass and is life times away from being mellowed like an old Italian, that is a fact.

>>> The Flexocors sound rough and/or bright with some fast orchestra passages, correct?

I have experienced all of this so I know exactly how you feel, I think.

This thread above was done many years ago and since then, new strings have come out. On the Ogligato's and Evah's, you will encounter other problems in Orchestra bowing, different than the Flexocor so don't go that route.

I suggest the NEW Passione strings, new formula for your modern bass that will tame your roughness away. Get the regular gauge if you want them to be similar thickness to the the Flex.92s or, for a little more meat to dig into, I suggest the Stark gauge which I consider to be Medium gauge feel and the regular ones to be a light/weich gauge. Regular Flex.92s are lighter than most other orchestra strings as well.

New model Passione Starks. They play as good a Flexocors and smoother then Belcantos.

Every bass has its 'sweet spot' string wise. You just have to find yours and save from buying everything out there in the process.

[Emanuele Carbone]

Hi, I'm back to this topic since that set of orchestral Flexocor I was talking about in my previous post which sounds a bit dead to me (especially the A string) on my bass, recently surprised me when I tried to tune it one tone up for solo tuning: it comes to life! the 3rd string, from having no body and punch, comes alive and gets plenty of power as a B, the tension is tauter but fine for me... tuning it back to EADG makes it floppy and as I said before the 3rd string and particularly its open A doesn't seem to speak well, from what I hear when playing. Playing that A on the 4th string (eg: 4th finger in 1st and half position) doesn't help that much. Raising the bridge action doesn't help much as well.
If I tune them up to F#BEA (solo) and play that A on the 4th string (eg: 4th finger in half position, what you read as G but plays as A), the bass and the same note sounds way more convincing.

I know that you'd rather have the instrument in front of you, but basing on this feedback, would you say it's more likely to be the instrument itself having an issue with certain notes/frequencies or more simply (and hopefully) a quite unfortunate mismatch of string model and bass, which doesn't work as a combination for orchestra tuning and changing them in favour of a tauter, heavier set might do the trick?

The color code of the strings suggest they definitely are an orchestra setting, but they feel and sound better as solo