What do you want in a bass ?

[Kevin Harrington]

I like Busetto (busseto?) corners. Could be cos I have a great pic of Scott LaFaro looking real cool with his busetto-cornered bass? And Rufus Reid's bass looks great with them too.

The scroll is one of the first thing I notice that will make or break a bass for me (aesthetically speaking only). I like a nice decent sized well proportioned scroll. I'm afraid I don't have the vocabulary to fully describe what I mean but the eyes of some scrolls I've seen are sometimes a little off-centre looking, giving the impression that it's a bit flat to one side. Or sometimes the scroll is just too small for my taste.

Carved heads can be amazing too. Some of them are works of art in themselves. But for me nothing can beat a good old fashioned scroll (with hat-peg tuners) for looks. Except maybe a Gamba-style open scroll...

A nice small design with the purfling below the button can be nice too. Nothing too fancy, I've seen some really nice understated flurrishes.

My old teacher in Cork had a beautiful old French bass that had a lovely curve at the end of the fingerboard. It looked really well on his bass. I can't remember if the tailpiece had a matching (or opposing) curve or if it was straight but I think it was the latter.

Apart from that, I generally prefer darker varnishes (I'm probably not alone there) but I'm not a fan of the fake antiquing process that is now unfortunately so common amoung violin makers.

Anyway, there ya have it, for what it's worth (wouldn't buy many penny sweets I'd imagine!)

[Matthew Heintz]

• Gamba shape
• 41 3/4" or 42" string length
• Simple purfling
• No fancy carving
• Big shoulders are fine (even preferred) so long as the overstand is sufficient to grant full access to the upper register
• Predrilled for Laborie endpin or something like the KC tilt block; or just make sure that the block is sufficiently sturdy to accept an angled endpin. More and more players use these and perhaps more would if basses were already prepared for them.
• Sloane tuning machines or something of equivalent quality
• Chromatic Extension; if it's between having an extension or fancy purling, carving and bee stings on violin corners, I'll take an extension any day of the week.
• I'm a sucker for nice flame, but many of the best basses that I've played have very plain wood and if using plain wood means more time/money for an extension, nice tuning machines, adjustable bridge... by all means use plain wood.
• Flat back vs. carved back: whatever you think works best, but, again, if it's an extra 100 hours to carve a back and you have a nice stable design for a flatback, save the time/money and put it into setup, wood etc...
• Simple bumpers (not everyone's keep of tea, but it's better than grinding the ribs)
• Detachable neck. It is becoming very, very difficult to travel. If your customer flies for even one or two gigs or auditions, you will easily save them hundreds of dollars.

In short, make it totally functional from day one.

[Ken Smith]

With all of these various demands, what are you expecting to spend on a Bass new or old and what are you willing to spend if you are aware that your wishes are beyond your means?

Maybe it would be good to put an expected or wishful price next to your wish list. You can then see depending on the maker and or/quality what is possible and what is not.

Personally, I cannot stand those angled endpins. I like my Basses with as few holes in them as possible. I plugged up one of those angled holes on a Bass that came in and gained about 20% more noticeable volume and depth in tone. I tested this 'dry' before gluing the 'custom fit' Plug in the Bass.

Also good to note besides just your wishes is what you will be doing with this Bass as well as what type/level player you are currently. Sometimes, a maker can suggest things you are not aware of as well as exclude a few things that may not be in your best personal interest.

Have you ever heard of this scenario? ..

Player: Hey, this bass doesn't work as well as I had hoped for. ..

Maker: I made exactly what you asked for. ..

Good communication and well as understanding between maker and player is a Necessity you can't afford to be without, not a Luxury.

Very often, the maker is a better player than the customer and/or works with and for better players than you might ever hope to be. In this case, take the 'Doctor's' advise!

[Matthew Heintz]

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

With all of these various demands, what are you expecting to spend on a Bass new or old and what are you willing to spend if you are aware that your wishes are beyond your means?

Good question/point. Since Martin asked in connection with his new build, presumably we're talking about new basses here. My hypothetical price range (not that I'm shopping): $17.5k to $24k. That's a broad range, but, not unreasonable, and, for a plain jane bass, I believe that it would include new basses from most luthiers in the US and Canada, while excluding many across the pond due to the Euro/dollar conversion. Other than the detachable neck, the bass that I described above is plain jane and would, I expect, be on the lower to mid end of the spectrum (flatback gamba with extension). Old basses are a whole different ballgame.

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

Personally, I cannot stand those angled endpins. I like my Basses with as few holes in them as possible. I plugged up one of those angled holes on a Bass that came in and gained about 20% more noticeable volume and depth in tone. I tested this 'dry' before gluing the 'custom fit' Plug in the Bass.

Then the KC tilt block or equivalent could be an option. No drilling. Relatively cheap and easy to add and remove. Of course, many notable players feel that the Laborie improves the sound of the bass. Personally, I didn't want to drill. I didn't notice a change one way or the other that I could attribute to the KC tilt block, but I changed a number of other variables, so I really can't determine. The bass did sound better with the tilt block than with the eggpin. In terms of playability, the angled pin made a world of difference for me, but, of course, it's not for everyone. Since Martin asked what I'd like to see, there you have it. You might find that a bass that was designed for the Laborie (rather than a bass later drilled for one by a luthier who may or may not have experience with the process) would have better results.

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

Also good to note besides just your wishes is what you will be doing with this Bass as well as what type/level player you are currently. Sometimes, a maker can suggest things you are not aware of as well as exclude a few things that may not be in your best personal interest.

Me = amateur, classical, been playing for 19 years. Other than the detachable neck, the bass that I described above is very close to my primary bass. The detachable neck would have saved me a few thousand dollars and a great deal of hassle, and for a player that is on the audition circuit or traveling to gigs, it could make the difference between affording to go or staying at home; this I know from my limited experience with traveling (between 5 cities over the last 15 years). Some luthiers obviously feel that the detachable neck compromises the bass, but a number of well respected luthiers (e.g., Ross, Lamarre, Hamm, Radelet, Auray, Charton) offer the option. A debate for another day. Radelet and Ross are in the above stated price range; I don't know about the others, but probably not.

[Ken McKay]

It shouldn't add much of anything to the price of a bench made DB. Nor will the beefier tailblock. Handmade basses are way underpriced for the time it takes to design and make a custom one. They cost about as much as bench made Cello and even some violins are 25 - 30K.

Ken, I gotta wonder about that 20% change in volume and depth of sound with one little hole plugged at the tailblock area. As far as pure acoustics, pschychoacoustics of bowed stringed instruments it should not make that much difference. OTOH I am sure you don't speak lightly about stuff like that.

[Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Ken McKay

It shouldn't add much of anything to the price of a bench made DB. Nor will the beefier tailblock. Handmade basses are way underpriced for the time it takes to design and make a custom one. They cost about as much as bench made Cello and even some violins are 25 - 30K.

Ken, I gotta wonder about that 20% change in volume and depth of sound with one little hole plugged at the tailblock area. As far as pure acoustics, pschychoacoustics of bowed stringed instruments it should not make that much difference. OTOH I am sure you don't speak lightly about stuff like that.

Well, for what ever reason I was able to feel the air shotting down out of this hole when I put my foot under the bass while playing it unplugged, the hole that is. It felt like it was actually down firing out of the hole, the sound that is. I can't say I measured the volume and tone at 20% but it was a noticeable and clear difference when plugged.

Do you believe that F-hole size matters much as far as volume and tone of a given bass? I haven't seen this discussed all that much around here or anywhere else. For the record, I do!

[Ken McKay]

No I haven't noticed any correlation of F hole size to either volume or depth of sound. This is easy to test if you cover a portion of the soundhole, it either changes or not.

From what I have seen and heard, the things that do seem to matter are f-hole placement. This might be from their effect on the top plate resonances. Of course this is hard to prove. I am thinking that wider spacing effects the depth because of the flexibility of the plate goes up across the grain when spaced wider apart. This would effect depth of sound the most I think if the f holes are wider spaced. But the air inside needs to be able to reinforce the plate movement or it is wasted movement. So air volume and plate resonance needs to match. More of this can be heard as more fundamental to the tone.

Holes in the side of the upper bout don't seem to effect depth or volume much. I have played Arnold's ergo and I heard him say this also.

A hole in a place of maximum rigidity of the plates (tailblock) might theoretically highly effected sound. I have read that air pressure is highest there. Since the air pressure reinforces the plate vibration of both the top and back, a loss of pressure could decrease volume or depth.

[Matthew Tucker]

Originally Posted by Ken Smith

Do you believe that F-hole size matters much as far as volume and tone of a given bass? I haven't seen this discussed all that much around here or anywhere else. For the record, I do!

So ... can you elaborate on exactly what you believe matters?